The Trials and Tribulations of Trying to Conceive when its just not happening (12m+)

jujugaboo

Sorry QQ that it didn't work out, fingers crossed for March.

Lisa, good luck with your TTC plan, look forward to viewing it. I just try and eat healthy but I a pretty good at that anyway and I don't need to lose any weight, its hard to cut out the chocolate and cake at times though.

Sausage, driving yourself mad yet (or is that just me in the 2WW), its the drugs that give you sore boobs but its not a sign that it hasn't worked. Keep everything crossed.

onstep - good luck with scan, make just you are drinking lots of water.

lisawood78

OK, this is my plan, unsure on order yet and any thoughts anyone has on it would be hugely appreciated! It is a huge epic though, be warned!

I guess most people who will read this know my situation, but if not I will give a very shortened version of it!

3 ICSI's & 1 FET with ex partner, male issues, terrible quality embryos (although responded great) and BFN each time.

New partner (now husband of 3 years) Spontaneous ruptured ectopic pregnancy March 2008, full left side salpingectomy.
Surgery revealed heavy adhesions and scarring and a badly damaged right tube, probably due to an infection in the past.

Advised to go straight for IVF to achieve a pregnancy, no problems with hubby.

1 full IVF, flare protocol due to egg quality issues in the past, produced great Embryos and went to blastocycts. BFN. Went for Immune testing as that was my (if not our) 5th cycle and it was getting ridiculous. Tests showed I had Protein C level Issues and MTHFR.

FET with steroid and clexane treatment, achieved a chemical result.

Full cycle 2, same protocol with the adition of crinone gel, BFP!! But bleeding from before test day and although initial bloods went up as expected it was soon deemed non viable and eventually at 9weeks gestation I had a full right side salpingectomy. So no tubes left. Final FET was also a BFN.

Not long had a hysteroscopy to check that there is nothing wrong in my uterus/womb etc and results came back clear, no lumps, bumps or anything untoward that could be causing problems.

So now we are here and do not know what to do now. Neither of us can settle for childlessness, at least not at this stage.
We have come up with 3 options and a potential order for them but I am not confident of any of it.


Option 1, full cycle again. We have looked at a cycle at ARGC. To be honest, we had an initial appointment there and we were gobsmacked at how disorganised, unproffesional and dirty the place was! I know many people swear by them, and have had good results but our visit really was appalling. Anyway, we are in the Midlands and a cycle at ARGC would involve me moving to London for at least a month. I have 3 giant breed dogs, am a part time childminder and my husband works away 5 days a week at least (Germany) so it purely and simply isn't possible.

So that leaves us with our current clinic (MFS) and undertaking a new cycle there with all the immune treatments etc and at least now I can not have another ectopic!! We have a review appointment in a month to talk it all though with them but my thoughts are varied. It would be amazing if it works, incredible, I imagine being pregant again and carrying our own baby but I also recall every bit of pain and sadness and unbearable grief when it fails once more, and the stress which increases each cycle which doesn't help!! And then of course there is the cost although this is a small consideration compared to everything else.

So then there is option 2, surrogacy (apologies if you can't discuss this here, I can't recall what was said about it) I have 2 people who have said they would do it for us without us asking (host) one is my SIL another is my friend, the mother of my Godchildren.

My SIL is my best friend, we are very close and I trust her implicity, she would do this at the drop of a hat if asked. She would be my preffered choice. However, she is 39, overweight and not hugely healthy (not being nasty here, just truthful, she would say it herself) She has also had 2 c-sections in the past and she is a full time childminder. If it worked she would not be able to return to work for a good while afterwards as I assume she would need another section and while I can do her job (am qualified and checked etc) I would then be doing her job and taking care of her and a new born baby. It would be worth it, but very very hard in reality.
My other friend is 30 and fitter and healthier, with 2 natural births under her belt. But it just doesn't feel as right or comfortable to 'use' her. I'm not sure why and I guess I need to examine that a bit more.

Option 3 is adoption. This one is really tricky.
We would prefer our own child of course but we can both accept an adopted child/ren as our own and love them just the same.
Good things are (for the adoption people to consider) we have a large home, my husband is co-owner in a highly profitable international company so we are financially stable, we have a close family nearby to help etc. I only work part time and for my husband so have lots of spare time. I am also a part time childminder, run a toddler group and have a lot of experience working with kids (I know this does not make me a parent)
Bad stuff to consider (and bear in mind I know very little about adoption really so these things may not even need to be worried about) My husband works away as I said, 75% of the time he is in Germany. We have a house there and he flies/drives home for holidays and 3 weekends out of 4. We have 3 Great danes as I said and I guess alot of people would not consider them suitable to live with small children. I have some horrors in my past, I was abused by a family member, and while that person was locked up and issued a restraining order etc (this was 15+ years ago) I do not know if these things come up during the adoption process and if so what affect it would/could have on it) I also suffered from depression as a result of this and needed medical help to combat this, again this was 15+years ago.

I am so confused with it all TBH, I want it all to happen yesterday of course but don't know what route to take, and DH is unsure also.

Any help at all that anyone can give, any opinions or thoughts on the subject, it would be most welcome.

Thank you so much for reading that pretty depressing essay!!
LW78 x

onestep

First of all ((hugs)). You've been through a heck of a lot, to put it mildly.

In no particular order, here are my thoughts. It's obvious that you haven't given up hope of having your own biological child, either through IVF for you, or surrogacy (IVF for your SIL, or friend; more on that later). What conclusions have previous cycle reviews reached? FWIW, I think it's really important to go with your gut feeling about clinics. If you aren't comfortable at a clinic, however impressive their statistics, it's going to impact on your own success. Zita West is a firm believer in the mind/body connections and its impact on fertility, and I do have some - limited - sympathy with that view. (Although I do not believe it to be as important a factor as she'd have us believe).

Surrogacy.. if you'd be more comfortable with your SIL then she's the one, rather than your friend. How would the 'rejected' one cope with being 2nd choice? And here's me being devil's advocate - What happens if they have a miscarriage? What happens if you pick your SIL, and you and DH split up? God forbid either of those things should happen, but it's necessary to explore the possibilities..

Adoption - How old are you? It might be as well to explore this option sooner rather than later, just because of age criteria. I think most councils would advise some counselling throughout the adoption process; I don't have any personal experience of this though. DH and I are considering fostering, maybe another option?

Apologies, this probably isn't very clear, or helpful. FWIW, it seems that you want to try another IVF cycle yourself, before drawing a line under it and trying something else. I find it helps me to think about how I would feel in 5 months, in 5 years and in 10 years. If my answers are the same for all 3, then I know exactly what I need to do. Wishing you bucketloads of luck xx

lisawood78

onestep wrote: »

First of all ((hugs)). You've been through a heck of a lot, to put it mildly.

In no particular order, here are my thoughts. It's obvious that you haven't given up hope of having your own biological child, either through IVF for you, or surrogacy (IVF for your SIL, or friend; more on that later). What conclusions have previous cycle reviews reached? FWIW, I think it's really important to go with your gut feeling about clinics. If you aren't comfortable at a clinic, however impressive their statistics, it's going to impact on your own success. Zita West is a firm believer in the mind/body connections and its impact on fertility, and I do have some - limited - sympathy with that view. (Although I do not believe it to be as important a factor as she'd have us believe).

Surrogacy.. if you'd be more comfortable with your SIL then she's the one, rather than your friend. How would the 'rejected' one cope with being 2nd choice? And here's me being devil's advocate - What happens if they have a miscarriage? What happens if you pick your SIL, and you and DH split up? God forbid either of those things should happen, but it's necessary to explore the possibilities..

Adoption - How old are you? It might be as well to explore this option sooner rather than later, just because of age criteria. I think most councils would advise some counselling throughout the adoption process; I don't have any personal experience of this though. DH and I are considering fostering, maybe another option?

Apologies, this probably isn't very clear, or helpful. FWIW, it seems that you want to try another IVF cycle yourself, before drawing a line under it and trying something else. I find it helps me to think about how I would feel in 5 months, in 5 years and in 10 years. If my answers are the same for all 3, then I know exactly what I need to do. Wishing you bucketloads of luck xx

My clinic can't find any other problems with me except for the highlighted problems from the Immune testing which I am treated for during treatment. They do not know what it doesn't work.

My stress levels get out of hand during IVF, well during the 2WW but I guess everyones do to some extent.

My friend wouldn't object if she wasn't 'chosen' she just wants me to be a Mum and woul be happy either way. Yes splitting up would need looking at, I have known him since I was 15 and we know each other inside out but of course things change. SIL is my husbands SIL also, his brothers wife. If it worked and she had a loss then we would have to deal with that at the time, same as if it didn't work, which is of course quite likely. We would need to do a lot of talking beforehand I think.

I'm heading for 34, have been TTC (with a break between partners!) for over 10 years now. I still have quite a lot of time in which to go down the adoption route but of course if we have more treatment then we have to wait between 6-12 months at least) before we can even look at it as they like you to have a break to make sure you are finished with treatment.

I honestly do not know what I want to do, I think I do and then it all changes almost on a whim atm. Even seeing a PG lady in the street or having a loving cuddle with a mindee can change my heart in one way or another!

Thank you so much x

onestep

lisawood78 wrote: »

My stress levels get out of hand during IVF, well during the 2WW but I guess everyones do to some extent.

<snip>

I honestly do not know what I want to do, I think I do and then it all changes almost on a whim atm. Even seeing a PG lady in the street or having a loving cuddle with a mindee can change my heart in one way or another!

what have you tried to reduce your stress levels? Yoga, meditation, acupuncture, hypnosis, more exercise - gentle of course!, immersing yourself in a hobby etc etc etc. Easy to suggest, not so easy to put into practise, I know.

It's not wrong that you don't know what you want If you'd have asked me last summer I'd have said there's no way I'd be doing injections and preparing for an IUI, and possible IVF now I've got this far. But here I am. While you're undecided, you need to keep talking to your DH, cut yourself lots of slack, and be kind to yourself and to him. Whatever you decide will be easier then. xx

sarahs999

Hi Lisa. I've sent you a PM. xx

fluffnutter

lisawood, you're still young and your protein C issues and MTHFR and not insurmountable. You say you've achieved poor results with the quality of embryos before. Have you considered egg donation? Husband's sperm, a well-matched egg and you get to carry the baby. Seems like an option...?

lisawood78

Hi fluffnutter. The quality issues all seem to be connected to my ex/ICSI. Since having IVF with my husband we have made lovely high quality blastocycts so that does not appear to be the problem. It is simply that they never take (or they do but in the wrong place)

The immune issues are not insurmountable, they simply do not know why I have had so many failures. And while yes, I am still young, I have had 8 rounds of ICSI/IVF/FET over 10 years and it has almost killed me (figuratively speaking) It is so hard to just keep knocking on the same door to be told you are not coming in from the cold once more.

Anyway, I am thread hogging. Thank you all so much for reading and for your advice and comments.

LW78 x

staffiecat

Hi LW78, Firstly I just wanted to say thanks for sharing your journey. Its been a hard road for you and DH and I hope that you guys get your forever baby. My thoughts are this:

1) Regarding the clinic for possible IVF. I think you have to go with your gut feelings here. If you go to the new clinic it seems to me that you won't feel comfortable or relax and this will be key to how you feel during the 2ww. If you go to the same clinic as before then yes they know you but of course you have sad memories but you need to ask yourself whether you would feel more at ease with them.

2) Surrogacy is a tricky issue. My sister has offered the same for me but I have (at the moment) dismissed that because she has not had her own children yet. What you need to consider is:

- how would you feel if your non-healthy friend led a non-healthy lifestyle during pregnancy? Would that bother you,
- I assume that you are thinking that it would be yours and DHs egg that she carries but there is still the issue of attachment. She has never given a child away before (assuming here) so she can't be sure how that will make her feel. This needs careful consideration too.
- you also need to consider how you are going feel during the pregnancy, will you feel left out, how will you cope with that.

Its clear that you have some wonderful friends and they are offering this to you but just make sure (as you already have) that you think of all the pros and cons and clearly agree on the route forward together.

3) Adoption. The only thing I can offer about this is that DH and I went to an adoption event about a year ago for information gathering. We have two big dogs and were concerned but they said the dogs form part of the assesment so that calmed me some. The issue that they really drove home however was that they have lots of couples waiting for babies but their highest demand is for couples to take on toddlers - is this something you would want to do, or would you want to wait for the baby, if so are you willing to wait the years that it may take (I realise of course that you have been but just trying to flag the issues).

I know from friends that the adoption process has a huge impact, they will delve into your life and they may ask you difficult questions, for example they could ask you whether you have ever suffered depression and for you that may lead on to other difficult topics so you need to just think for a moment whether you can emotionally have those discussions. However, never feel ashamed about your past, it is part of the makeup of who you are. You had a terrible experience but look at your life now ! They would be crazy not to take you on ! You would be able to give a child an amazing life. This is the key part of the process, remember that yes they will delve but ultimately you haven't been on this journey for the last 10 years to not provide a wonderful home to a child.

The last thing is that they did say we would need to be able to show a clear period where we had stopped the IVF and had grieved for the natural child that we couldn't have, so waiting 12 months is probably spot on.


I hope this helps in some way, I don't know you but just from your story I feel that you are an amazing person. Lots of hugs,

xx

PS 64kgs at 5ft6 = skinny

lisawood78

Off to collect mindees from school but staffiecat,
Thank you xx