Thousands of police to lose jobs as forces feel the pinch

harrup

lynzpower wrote: »

Completely agree. I have seen enough episodes of roadwars and of that ilk to see that this is true. Man steals a car, police catch him conversation goes a bit like this

Copper-" Excuse me sir would you mind stepping out of the vehicle for me"
Crim " ****you i aint **** listening to you you **** **********"
Copper " If you could please do as I ask and step out of the vehicle for me"
Crim "**** **** **** " you **** ********"
Copper - if you dont choose to step out of the vehicle, you may need to know we maty choose to use physical power to remove you rfrom the vehicle do you understand that"

Crim steps out of the car.

Cop " thanks for that sir, now if you wouldnt mind placing your palms on to the vehicle for me a moment whilst we take a look at the vehicle"
Crim " you aint going in that car you **** *********** "
Cop- " please sir, you need to tone your language down, im not swaering at you, so please dont swear at me" etc etc etc

:wall:

Why dont they just throw crims to the floor and get on with the job instead of prancing around with niceties?

It's a totally apt description.

The current situation IS a joke and it DOES render the police officers a joke.

My OH supports unarmed police. "Violence begetting violence" or something to that effect, citing the USA as an example. Total nonsense, IMO. The States do have problems in that respect - but this has to do with their lax gun laws and their rights to bear arms not with their POs being armed.

I don't live in a crime ridden town, but I've seen youngsters heckling officers for the pure fun of it - who could do.....nothing. Doesn't bode well for more serious offences if a trained PO can't even stand up to a lippy teenager. But they can't. Not allowed to and/or truck loads of paperwork to complete if they do. Pathetic.

ruggedtoast

lynzpower wrote: »

It was fantastic to see a police force thats not naffing around apologising for doing thier job. .

Yes I saw that. I feel a bit sorry for the police sometimes because they've been so messed about by decades of weird policies that have given them a very undefined role.

I know someone whos a copper, the paperwork they have to do is unreal thanks to all Nu-Labs directives and rewards detecting multiple petty crimes not a few serious ones. He's a very conscientious guy but I think all this admin makes it rather easy for less motivated colleagues to get out of doing much.

In addition on the one hand he's meant to be a front line of defense for the public, though goes around mostly unarmed, and on the other hand they have to go to all these training courses which you'd think would be more suitable for social workers.

Dont get me wrong I think there definitely needs to be investment in counsellors for drug abuse and resolving domestic conflict etc, I'm just not sure it should be directed at the same people who are meant to be dealing with rampaging drunks and drug dealers with uzis.

Generali

lynzpower wrote: »

I agree. I doubt you saw it Gen as it was I rthink after youd left but there was a prog on not long ago with louis theroux ( swoon) who went with the police in IIRC detroit

It was fantastic to see a police force thats not naffing around apologising for doing thier job. Straight away after I watched road wars thoough and felt thoroughly deflated. I watch a lot of these shows as I have a secret desire to be a copper however, theres no way I can run over walls sunhill style

We have now set a new rule in the house, no police shows, its too depressing.

A mate over here is a gaoler. It's very interesting to discuss the difference between policy and outcome.

lostinrates

I am undecided how I feel about British police being armed, but I have to say giving policemen guns does NOT give them respect nor stop them 'getting lip' IME, not in moderate countries.

harrup

lostinrates wrote: »

I am undecided how I feel about British police being armed, but I have to say giving policemen guns does NOT give them respect nor stop them 'getting lip' IME, not in moderate countries.

Hmm, interesting as I was all set to agree with you there.

But you know....I'm actually not so sure after thinking about it. Isn't it our overall perception of our opponent's strength - or lack thereof - which determines our behaviour towards him/her? If you perceive someone as a hapless, powerless entity .....it promotes disrespect.

Can't say I have much dealings with the police be that here or abroad but all I can say is this: when I'm in the USA and a PO askes me to do step out of the car or whatever, I wouldn't even dream of debating or second-guessing his instruction. Doesn't matter if that PO is half my age and has half of my education. I just comply. Why? Because the ramifications if I don't aren't all that palatable to me. They DO have authority and they ain't afraid to use it if necessary.

Here in the UK? I just might engage in a bit of frilly to-ing and fro-ing if the mood strikes me. Because - what's the police officer going to do about it? And if I without any criminal intentions or lust for anti-social behaviour feel like that.... it's highly unlikely that a testosterone filled uppity youngster sees it differently. For them "might is right". Their gang leaders aren't elected for being members of MENSA. It's the the strongest and most courageous who get the most respect.

Meaning we ought to provide means to our POs that THEY are perceived as being stronger and more couragous. Arms is one of them.

All this made more sense in my head somehow.....:o

harrup

In trying to find out whether there are other European - or any! - countries with unarmed police I found the following debate:

http://www.idebate.org/debatabase/topic_details.php?topicID=275

Very interesting.

Still don't know who else has an unarmed Police Force, though. Perhaps nobody?

harrup

harrup wrote: »

In trying to find out whether there are other European - or any! - countries with unarmed police I found the following debate:

http://www.idebate.org/debatabase/topic_details.php?topicID=275

Very interesting.

Still don't know who else has an unarmed Police Force, though. Perhaps nobody?

And even MORE interesting is this exchange btw UK and US officers.

http://pcsouthwest.wordpress.com/2006/11/16/armed-or-unarmed/

Oh, crikey...I've hijacked the original thread. I hate when others do that. My apologies.

lostinrates

It keeps deleting my reply. I give up. Pity.

chris_spackman

In the states the Police get called Sir.

If they ask you to do something you do it and if you don't then you're a brave person.

For all their faults the Americans respect the law.

The UK needs to let the Police be the Police and it is sad that they can't do there jobs for fear of offending someone and 'protecting' a Rapists / Child Abuser or Terrorists 'Human Rights'

I was watching this show once about the Police in the States and this guy on a push bike went through stop signs, riding on the pavement and swaying from side to side.

The Police 'asked' him to stop and he got of his bike straight away. We all know what would happen over here. Lots of abuse and some have the nerve to speak on their phone when they have bveen piulled over for driving using their phone whilst the officer is talking to him.

Mathew

I'm not sure that the police force here has the confidence in the Gov to support and back them up. Given that if it an officer was to shoot somebody there is a real likelihood of suspension whilst its investigated, and charges of manslaughter could even follow. Thats quite a responsibility. Not to speak of the stress that was cause.
I wonder how long they (not sure who) will resist for, surely its inevitable? Some will say it will be a sad day for tradition and the stereotypical British Bobby going out the window!, however, I think they may need to move with the sad times.