Surprised at attitudes

CB1979_2

^^^ see one of few of the lesser sex with their head's screwed on

the age old "tell me how you want me to answer" scenario

dmg24

CB1979 wrote: »

@ dmg - well you're obviously a woman, you can tell by your tone

trust me, i have very open friendships and we all tell each other alot about what's going on in our lives.

none of my mates would have any issues telling me their mrs' were being unreasonable and i don't get hardly any moans about that.

anyway for all you ladies that are open minded, you're all great!
for all the man hating wenches, boooo hisssss booooo to you all! lol

Your responses just show that you are still young, and still naive.

Sorry to be blunt, but you are!

bertiebots

CB1979 wrote: »

^^^ see one of few of the lesser sex with their head's screwed on

the age old "tell me how you want me to answer" scenario

You have obviously missed my point by claiming that I am a lesser of a man...I am no more "lesser" than you are "better". Accept that we are differant....you dont have to belittle people to get your point across.;)

hutless

Thanks for all the responses. I have a new female flatmate and I must admit her attitudes towards the issues raised surprised me and was different to what I was used to - however was quite similar to what i see on here. I understand that this is not a cross-section of society and not a cross-section of the women or men i meet on a daily basis or spend time with - but i think it is still useful to see how some people think as it helps when you are trying to understand another point of view.

First, I dont agree that either sex should have one night stands. I suppose my point was that women have greater sexual freedom than they did in the past - but I was born in the 80's so what do I know. I could be completely wrong.

I understand that if someone comes on the forum discussing a personal problem, then criticism of them is going to be largley unhelpful. They generally need support and an arm round them - but I think some of them also need to be told that they are overeacting or potentially even in the wrong. Agreeing with someone when they are wrong will lead them to make the same mistakes.

Re: Engagement Ring - I see the ring as a symbol of our love, if that love is gone then the ring should be returned. If its a gift, then why are more women not buying men gifts when they get engaged? If you view it as a gift - then i think you should keep it - like people say, you cant return each gift. But I dont see it as a gift - i see it more as a symbol and as such would expect it to be returned. Its not a financial thing - if the ring cost me £100 or £10000, i would still want it back.

With regard to the point about men getting custody of kids - to me this is a key issue. I strongly support Fathers for Justice and think there needs to be more fairness (both for men and women) on each individual child case.I also think that it shouldnt be assumed that a child shuold stay with its mother - fathers can be just as good single parents as mothers.

I agree many traditions are positive and breaking them just for the sake of it is not correct. However, I dont think females (or males) should go through the list of traditions keeping and getting rid of the ones that suit them. We should assess each tradition on its own merit and were it sits in modern society - not that its been about for years and so must be kept or gotten rid of.

Finally, I think in the last 50 years, the role of the women has been redefined. You can be a mother, a daughter, a lover, a friend, a housewife, an accountant, a teacher - you can be anything you want. Maybe modern day man's role is not so clearly defined and we still feel like we are being told by society to grow up, get a job and provide. I'm not saying that what women on here are telling or expecting men to do, I think its just so in-grained into society that thats a mans role, its hard for men to follow certain dreams.

hev_2

As a female - I bought my own engagement ring, and my own wedding ring and it came to a grand total of £25. Yes, twenty five pounds only, for both. OH doesn't wear either. I can't help feel that there are still those who would expect me to 'return' the engagement ring if we split. :rolleyes:

Roles are changing, and yes genders communicate differently but what I have noticed is that women are being asked to adapt to their men's ways, for example by reading one of the books by Alan Pease and making the effort to understand and communicate correctly with their male partner rather than the other way round.

Women are statistically more likely to log on to a forum and more likely to communicate about relationships on these boards, so you are going to get a majority of female posters and a majority of female view points.

30 years ago if a woman was beaten up by her husband (and only sluts lived with someone they were not married to) then it was too bad. She made her bed... Now if a woman (or man, because domestic violence has always affected both but more often it is the woman who suffers) is getting abused then she can come on here, share her feelings and get support and advice. This includes how to get out of an abusive relationship and a lot of men are unhappy about that.

I think the other thing that should be noted in relationships is that women do continue to analyse the relationship much more than a man. Even today a man is more likely to define himself by what he does where a woman is more likely to define herself by her relationships. A woman is more likely to decide to change a bad relationship because it is more likely to affect her definition of herself.

FWIW I think that these boards are actually not too bad and not just filled with vicious man haters. I do think, however, that there are a lot of people who post on here who have had horrendous experiences with men and are posting from the perspective of those experiences. To deny those experiences is to be complicit in them.

vixarooni

I feel that since the wars, women have progressed so much in terms of being able to vote, getting an education, being a mum and having a career ect and men havent had the same advancement. As much as i think its brilliant for women to have this choice, i also ponder is it good for society? Perhaps we are all getting obese because there is no one at home to cook a proper meal and with husband and wife both too knackered after work they cook something rubbish in a microwave. Its all little things that account for a lot in a day to day routine.

Im 21, just finishing my degree and i feel this pressure that i have to have a career as well as have babies. In reality i want to get a job but then i also want to be a mum more than anything, but i dunno when im meant to fit that in? I feel that because ive got a degree ive got to go and have a career else i'll be a let down. Perhaps its just pressure im putting on myself, but i definatly feel that im expected to do it all and be super at it at the same time.

I do disagree with the fact that a woman can sleep around without being classed as a slag. I know girl mates who still carry that label from high school. I dont think that will ever go to be honest.

Mrs_Weasley

CB1979 wrote: »

welcome to the wonderful world of MSE aka Womens Liberation Front aka The World's biggest man hater cult

:rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl:

hev_2

hutless wrote: »

With regard to the point about men getting custody of kids - to me this is a key issue. I strongly support Fathers for Justice and think there needs to be more fairness (both for men and women) on each individual child case.I also think that it shouldnt be assumed that a child shuold stay with its mother - fathers can be just as good single parents as mothers. .

I would be more sympathetic to Fathers 4 Justice if there had been less abuse of court staff (powerless to do stuff but still seriously harrassed) or those who seek to protect children (threatening phone calls, stalking, abuse). How about that thread recently where a woman is scared her child will be abused if it goes to visit the father, but threatened with Jail if she doesn't allow full access?

I have worked in the courts and I know people who have worked in domestic violence and in my experience for every biatch that uses the children as a weapon there are about thirty men who don't want to know about their own children. And don't get me started about men who battle to get supervised contact and then whisper to their children how they are going to find them and their mother and burn them in their own home.

I agree that the rights of men should be more considered when it comes to access/residence but my knee jerk reaction to Fathers 4 Justice is extremely negative.

FWIW the legal position is that the engagement ring is a gift, but traditionally if a woman broke off the engagement then she should return it. That goes back to the days when a married woman was not allowed to have property in her own name.

hutless

hev wrote: »

what I have noticed is that women are being asked to adapt to their men's ways, for example by reading one of the books by Alan Pease and making the effort to understand and communicate correctly with their male partner rather than the other way round.

Whilst I 100% agree that women read these types of books more than men, I think you underestimate how many men do buy these books and how many men are making an attempt (maybe a poor one but they are trying!) to understand and communicate with women better. I'm not saying we are perfect by any stretch, but as long as a guy is trying, can you ask anymore?

hev_2

hutless wrote: »

Whilst I 100% agree that women read these types of books more than men, I think you underestimate how many men do buy these books and how many men are making an attempt (maybe a poor one but they are trying!) to understand and communicate with women better. I'm not saying we are perfect by any stretch, but as long as a guy is trying, can you ask anymore?

Sorry - it's just that I haven't met any man who has, apart from OH who asked me to read them and consistently reminds me of the bits about how men think. :rolleyes:

I'm not trying to have a go - I think men are struggling to find the appropriate models and with the breakdown of family and less families growing up with a steady male role model I do think men have a problem. What my feeling is (so female - using feelings as a basis for a discussion :rolleyes: joke!) is that there are a few men out there who are using this lack of male role to try and get women to go back to more traditional roles. I think it is important to find new roles/definitions/support for men without eroding the rights of women.

Another personal example. I am trying to get myself to learn how to diy and decorate. OH has always said that it is a man's job, and if I do it I will be eroding his self esteem as a man. There is one room in this house that has been decorated in fourteen years and you would not believe the amount of diy jobs that need doing. So I have decided I am going to start doing it and the amount of sarcastic comments I have had since I successfully put up a coat rack (Tommy Walsh eat your heart out!) are untrue. Men complain that women are eroding their roles but sometimes there just isn't an option. Now I have the choice of taking a load of snide remarks or living in a wreck. I do consider I have a good husband in OH and I am not considering leaving him, but really the cards are less stacked in a woman's favour than you would think.