Who is the Registered Keeper Between Selling Car and DVLA Updating Their Record?

born_again

Nsar1 said:

It's the buyer who is stressing. He was advised by the DVLA not to drive the car unitl is resolved and had his policy on the new car cancelled. I'm trying to help him.

Why was his policy cancelled? Can't just be DVLA issue, as not being registered keeper is not a reason to cancel insurance.

Clearly DVLA must have their details to contact them.

You really should have made that clear in the post. Or you would not have got some of the answers. As it is not your issue.

Car_54

Nsar1 said:

Jenni_D said:

Don't you think that's a critical piece of information that should have been provided much earlier? 🤷‍♀️🤦‍♀️

How does it affect the answer of who is the registered keeper in this situation? It is simply the context to why I am asking the question. 

But you've been given the answer. You are the RK until the DVLA process the change. That doesn't help your buyer, but it is what it is.

paul_c123

It depends how the question is worded on the application for the insurance. Normally they ask "Are you the registered keeper and owner of this car?" with a Yes/No choice. Clearly if you buy a new (to you) car and you will be the RK in the future for the vast majority of the length of your ownership, then there is no risk to the insurer to interpret the first few days as DVLA does its admin as simply a time delay due to the workings of DVLA. I am surprised the insurance company didn't interpret it as such and let it go.

Perhaps there is another reason the buyer had their insurance cancelled so soon after inception. But that's the buyer's issue, who isn't the OP.

And the sale is complete anyway, right??? Or is there a twist to the story.

Nsar1

Car_54 said:

Nsar1 said:

Jenni_D said:

Don't you think that's a critical piece of information that should have been provided much earlier? 🤷‍♀️🤦‍♀️

How does it affect the answer of who is the registered keeper in this situation? It is simply the context to why I am asking the question. 

But you've been given the answer. You are the RK until the DVLA process the change. That doesn't help your buyer, but it is what it is.

The opinion that I'm the RK conflicts directly with how the Police define the term registered keeper. Even those suggesting I'm the RK agree that the Police wouldn't pursue me. I'm just trying to help a bloke I sold the car to who is getting the run around from the DVLA and his insurer

GrumpyDil

Nsar1 said:

From (amongst others) the West Yorkshire Police Website: "The registered keeper should be the person who is actually using / keeping the vehicle and this is not necessarily the owner of the vehicle or the person who is paying for it." This the problem: the registered keeper (until the DVLA update their register) is someone who is not the registered keeper in the eyes of the law.

The police offering their view doesn't have any legal impact unless tested in court. In fact I disagree with it as I am the RK of a car but my daughter is using/keeping it and that is what is declared with the insurance company. Nothing illegal with that position.

My view is that until the system is updated you will be the registered keeper.

As the registered keeper if you received correspondence about speeding/parking offences you would respond by saying I may be the RK as DVLA have not updated their records yet but I have sold the car and am therefore neither the keeper or the owner.

Sorry, meant to ask did the buyer initiate a conversation about this as quite frankly I have never thought of this as being an issue and have always said on an insurance application I am the RK if I have sent off the new keeper slip or more normally now, updated the details online. 

Ectophile

Ultimately, ir's the DVLA who hold the register of registered keepers.  So until they have updated their register, it's the previous keeper.

Car_54

Nsar1 said:

Car_54 said:

Nsar1 said:

Jenni_D said:

Don't you think that's a critical piece of information that should have been provided much earlier? 🤷‍♀️🤦‍♀️

How does it affect the answer of who is the registered keeper in this situation? It is simply the context to why I am asking the question. 

But you've been given the answer. You are the RK until the DVLA process the change. That doesn't help your buyer, but it is what it is.

The opinion that I'm the RK conflicts directly with how the Police define the term registered keeper. Even those suggesting I'm the RK agree that the Police wouldn't pursue me. I'm just trying to help a bloke I sold the car to who is getting the run around from the DVLA and his insurer

The police’s opinion is neither here nor there. The only people who can define the RK are the DVLA.

Anyway, presumably your buyer’s main problem is that he can’t tax the car until it’s resolved? And you won’t get a refund on any unused tax until then.

TooManyPoints

From (amongst others) the West Yorkshire Police Website: "The registered keeper should be the person who is actually using / keeping the vehicle and this is not necessarily the owner of the vehicle or the person who is paying for it."

Which illustrates perfectly why the police are the very last people to rely on for legal advice.

It would be interesting to learn how they arrived at that advice and in particular why most finance and leasing companies do not comply with it. Since there are large numbers of vehicles owned by such companies who remain the Registered Keepers of their vehicles even though other people are "actually using / keeping" them and since this does not generally cause any great problems, it makes me wonder why the police think it is important to do otherwise.

It is also worth mentioning that Section 172 of the Road Traffic Act (which covers the duty to provide the driver's details when the police suspect that an offence has been committed) does not mention the Registered Keeper at all.

born_again

Looking aback at this the crux of the matter is why the V5 was not recognised.

So how long had the OP had the car, had there been a plate change/put on retention? 

So was using a wrong V5?

Car_54

TooManyPoints said:

From (amongst others) the West Yorkshire Police Website: "The registered keeper should be the person who is actually using / keeping the vehicle and this is not necessarily the owner of the vehicle or the person who is paying for it."

It is also worth mentioning that Section 172 of the Road Traffic Act (which covers the duty to provide the driver's details when the police suspect that an offence has been committed) does not mention the Registered Keeper at all.

True, but the Road Traffic Offenders Act 1988 (s 1(1(c(ii))) does require the NIP to be served on either the driver or the RK.