Scam?

jaypers

People here suggesting that those of us on here saying the signed form isn’t enforceable could be wrong…….oh come on!! It’s a scam. What they are trying to do is a crime. Any suggestion that a scammer would even attempt to enforce legal action, let alone have a case is one of the most ridiculous notions imaginable. 

gt94sss2

agent69 said:

I'm curious about all the people saying it is an illegal contract that is not enforceable. Has anyone seen what was actually signed?

With respect, your post and others suggesting things like 14 day cooling off periods are not helpful as they wrongly suggest that this might not be a scam. Neither is the one suggesting sending them fake documents.

It is important not to engage with such spammers as all you are doing is putting yourself down as someone gullible and attract similar scams in future.

Rollinghome

Aidanmc said:

agent69 said:

I'm curious about all the people saying it is an illegal contract that is not enforceable. Has anyone seen what was actually signed?

I assume the misrepresentation will be what was verbally assured, and that the £40k return will not appear anywhere in writing.

The OP has seen a copy of the form, but the relative did not want it posted here

@[Deleted User] Surly if you relatives personal details on the form were hidden you could show us the form?

No one needs to see the form.  No "ifs" or "buts", if the basic details given in the first post are correct, then it's a SCAM, and an very well known one that has been used to steal money for many years.  So I can't really see how it would be helpful to have it seen by strangers on an internet forum who are unlikely to have any legal qualifications in contract law.

eskbanker

gt94sss2 said:
If your relative don't take action themselves,  I suggest you report the issue as well as telling their bank what is occurring so they can take preventive action.

What preventive action do you think they can take if receiving a warning from a third party with no authority on the account?  How would you feel if your ability to pay someone was affected by something the bank had been told by (what is to them) a random stranger?

Aidanmc

Rollinghome said:

Aidanmc said:

agent69 said:

I'm curious about all the people saying it is an illegal contract that is not enforceable. Has anyone seen what was actually signed?

I assume the misrepresentation will be what was verbally assured, and that the £40k return will not appear anywhere in writing.

The OP has seen a copy of the form, but the relative did not want it posted here

@[Deleted User] Surly if you relatives personal details on the form were hidden you could show us the form?

No one needs to see the form.  No "ifs" or "buts", if the basic details given in the first post are correct, then it's a SCAM, and an very well known one that has been used to steal money for many years.  So I can't really see how it would be helpful to have it seen by strangers on an internet forum who are unlikely to have any legal qualifications in contract law.

I'm not doubting that its a scam, but showing the form may help others how the scam is played out and tactics the scammers use

jaypers

Ok, here’s some practical stuff that may help…….

https://www.independentage.org/get-advice/money/scams/how-to-help-someone-if-you-think-theyre-being-scammed    - Step by step guide.
https://www.actionfraud.police.uk/    - You can report here for a victim. This is also linked in the above site.

There seem to be a lot of unhelpful comments on here speculating about possible validity of some elements of what’s happened. Absolutely nothing about this carries any weight in favour of the scammers. The person being referred to is 100% in the right and will only be protected. Nothing is going to happen to them through signing the fake scammy forms but they are at risk of losing real money if someone doesn’t intervene and stop this now. 

jaypers

Some further info from my Action Fraud link above relating to investment fraud - https://www.actionfraud.police.uk/a-z-of-fraud/share-sale-and-investment-fraud

Get your relative to check the FCA register for the company they are supposedly dealing with (as mentioned in this link). Those 2 things will give you further ammo for them to cease all contact with these people. 

1spiral

gt94sss2 said:

[Deleted User] said:

Thanks everyone for your comments.

I've just spoken to my relative again, and asked him to look again at this thread which he says he has done.

He is becoming concerned himself that it could potentially be a scam, but still feels that the document that he signed is legally binding.  He has emailed me with copies of the document with signed signature, but when I asked his permission to copy to the website he was unwilling.  It seems to refer to a company called Greyt and Lewis, (name corrected) with Fidelity as insurer.  I have to admit, it all looks legal.

It's not legal.

Greyt and Lewis are known scammers who the FCA have publicly warned against.

https://www.fca.org.uk/news/warnings/greyt-lewis-management-inc

The document/contract is fake regardless of how real it looks like.

If your relative don't take action themselves,  I suggest you report the issue as well as telling their bank what is occurring so they can take preventive action.

The link in this post is the single most important link for the victim to read.

gt94sss2

eskbanker said:

gt94sss2 said:
If your relative don't take action themselves,  I suggest you report the issue as well as telling their bank what is occurring so they can take preventive action.

What preventive action do you think they can take if receiving a warning from a third party with no authority on the account?  How would you feel if your ability to pay someone was affected by something the bank had been told by (what is to them) a random stranger?

It means they can flag the customer as potentially vulnerable for instance and apply greater scrutiny to unusual transactions.

I'm not saying giving over the head of the account holder directly to their bank is my preferred response but it is an option. 

As for what they or the police/bank can do

https://www.ukfinance.org.uk/news-and-insight/blog/vulnerable-victims-notifications-bringing-together-banks-and-law-enforcement

Fraud is usually reported via Action Fraud (https://www.actionfraud.police.uk/reporting-fraud-and-cyber-crime) and I would encourage the OP to assist their relative to report it.

[Deleted User]

Thanks very much for the information and links, have emailed them to my relative..

But it's not good news!  The American 'office' have been on the phone to him this evening for over an hour, advising him how to pay!  Unfortunately, he followed their advice and tried sending the money through his bank, but the transfer was rejected 4 times!

If that doesn't shout Scam, then I don't know what does!

However, he is determined to go into his bank branch tomorrow morning to ask them to transfer the money.  Both myself and my son, plus all the links sent, and the whole of MSE seems unable to convince him. 
 
He looks like a lost cause, I'm hoping someone at his bank can talk some sense into him, but thanks everyone for your help.