Scam?

gelato_cat

[Deleted User] said:

Thanks everyone for your comments.

I've just spoken to my relative again, and asked him to look again at this thread which he says he has done.

He is becoming concerned himself that it could potentially be a scam, but still feels that the document that he signed is legally binding.  He has emailed me with copies of the document with signed signature, but when I asked his permission to copy to the website he was unwilling.  It seems to refer to a company called Ernst and Lewis, with Fidelity as insurer.  I have to admit, it all looks legal.

Some associate of the American woman is going to contact him again later today informing him how to pay!  It seems they want him to pay using some sort of transfer system, but he says he will only pay by credit card or some means which offers protection.

I also mentioned about a 14 day get out clause, but apparently, according to the woman American law doesn't have this protection.

He is going to contact us again later.

What does he think will happen to him if he doesn't uphold his end of the agreement?  (Apart from not being given the promised £40k?)

Aidanmc

@[Deleted User] 

https://www.centrica.com/investors/shareholder-centre/share-fraudsters/

Send this link to your friend

Reaper

[Deleted User] said:

He is becoming concerned himself that it could potentially be a scam, but still feels that the document that he signed is legally binding. 

It's not. Even if USA law applies (which I doubt) contracts made where one side is misrepresenting the facts or is acting fraudulently then the contract is unenforceable. [link]

I think everything that can be said has now been said. If this is not enough to convince him then nothing will.

AmityNeon

[Deleted User] said:

I've just spoken to my relative again, and asked him to look again at this thread which he says he has done.

He is becoming concerned himself that it could potentially be a scam, but still feels that the document that he signed is legally binding. He has emailed me with copies of the document with signed signature, but when I asked his permission to copy to the website he was unwilling. It seems to refer to a company called Ernst and Lewis, with Fidelity as insurer. I have to admit, it all looks legal.

Contracts are not enforceable if there is no genuine offer or proposal. Note that malicious use of AI can make scams look incredibly convincing.

What your friend must do:

• Block their phone numbers, email addresses and all other forms of contact.
• Keep copies of all correspondence as evidence for future reference.
• Report everything to Action Fraud immediately.
• Try not to worry; scammers deliberately exploit vulnerability to increase pressure.

In the astronomically unlikely event that this is indeed a genuine contract, any legitimate company would completely understand this reasonable course of action and would not attempt to enforce the contract litigiously (which involves legal costs). The involvement of Action Fraud (and potentially law enforcement) helps build a genuine case.

Rollinghome

It's a well-known scam, and anyone who bought privatisation shares will have been at risk because share certificates were issued and the buyers details were listed on the share register. I remember getting calls myself a long while back.

The first priority should be to ensure that the money doesn't leave his bank. You could try to have him phone his bank for advice, just to confirm what you have told him, or better still, go into his bank to ask. Once they know there is a possibility of him passing money to fraudsters, then they will have a responsibility to take reasonable steps to prevent the fraud happening or be responsible for losses. If you know only the name of his bank, then I'd imagine that just a written notification would make it impossible to deny responsibility and so get their attention.

It's those legal responsibilities now born by banks that are the reason for all those questions each time we try to make a large bank transfer. Scammers are ruthless, professional con-artists preying on anyone with a little hard-earned savings, and there's no shame in being caught by them.

jaypers

[Deleted User] said:

Thanks everyone for your comments.

I've just spoken to my relative again, and asked him to look again at this thread which he says he has done.

He is becoming concerned himself that it could potentially be a scam, but still feels that the document that he signed is legally binding.  He has emailed me with copies of the document with signed signature, but when I asked his permission to copy to the website he was unwilling.  It seems to refer to a company called Ernst and Lewis, with Fidelity as insurer.  I have to admit, it all looks legal.

Some associate of the American woman is going to contact him again later today informing him how to pay!  It seems they want him to pay using some sort of transfer system, but he says he will only pay by credit card or some means which offers protection.

I also mentioned about a 14 day get out clause, but apparently, according to the woman American law doesn't have this protection.

He is going to contact us again later.

If he’s taken to court for ‘breach of contract’ and loses I will happily pay his fine. That cannot and will not happen to him here. I would stake my life on it. 

agent69

I'm curious about all the people saying it is an illegal contract that is not enforceable. Has anyone seen what was actually signed?

I assume the misrepresentation will be what was verbally assured, and that the £40k return will not appear anywhere in writing.

Aidanmc

agent69 said:

I'm curious about all the people saying it is an illegal contract that is not enforceable. Has anyone seen what was actually signed?

I assume the misrepresentation will be what was verbally assured, and that the £40k return will not appear anywhere in writing.

The OP has seen a copy of the form, but the relative did not want it posted here

@[Deleted User] Surly if you relatives personal details on the form were hidden you could show us the form?

agent69

Aidanmc said:

agent69 said:

I'm curious about all the people saying it is an illegal contract that is not enforceable. Has anyone seen what was actually signed?

I assume the misrepresentation will be what was verbally assured, and that the £40k return will not appear anywhere in writing.

The OP has seen a copy of the form, but the relative did not want it posted here

@[Deleted User] Surly if you relatives personal details on the form were hidden you could show us the form?

So all the people on here saying it is unenforceable have no idea what it says?

gt94sss2

[Deleted User] said:

Thanks everyone for your comments.

I've just spoken to my relative again, and asked him to look again at this thread which he says he has done.

He is becoming concerned himself that it could potentially be a scam, but still feels that the document that he signed is legally binding.  He has emailed me with copies of the document with signed signature, but when I asked his permission to copy to the website he was unwilling.  It seems to refer to a company called Greyt and Lewis, (name corrected) with Fidelity as insurer.  I have to admit, it all looks legal.

It's not legal.

Greyt and Lewis are known scammers who the FCA have publicly warned against.

https://www.fca.org.uk/news/warnings/greyt-lewis-management-inc

The document/contract is fake regardless of how real it looks like.

If your relative don't take action themselves,  I suggest you report the issue as well as telling their bank what is occurring so they can take preventive action.