New Ford Capri being launched TOMORROW

NBLondon

MouldyOldDough said:

NBLondon said:

This one?  https://www.carandclassic.com/car/C1685338     If I was paying near £50K for a classic I'd need 1) somewhere to keep it under cover  2) a boring modern car to go to the tip/ garden centre/ supermarket in.   

The wheels are wrong with that one

Should be like this for original 5.5" *13 - makes me wonder whether the rest of the car did not start life as a 1.3 L

 

It's advertised as "matching numbers" so that would be easy to check before buying.   Possibly it was ordered with non-standard wheels from the dealer?

That's another point about the classic though - you can (if you know what you're doing) upgrade them later and swap bits about.  Bet no-one can do that with the EV version...

DullGreyGuy

NBLondon said:
That's another point about the classic though - you can (if you know what you're doing) upgrade them later and swap bits about.  Bet no-one can do that with the EV version...

You can't? Dont remember Tesla doing a 2 door convertible Model S? There's also a CyberTruck on snow tracks out there too. 

Sure, its harder to tinker with the powertrain is much more complex but not fair to say you can't change the body, wheels etc

Grumpy_chap

DullGreyGuy said:

NBLondon said:
That's another point about the classic though - you can (if you know what you're doing) upgrade them later and swap bits about.  Bet no-one can do that with the EV version...

You can't? Dont remember Tesla doing a 2 door convertible Model S? There's also a CyberTruck on snow tracks out there too. 

Sure, its harder to tinker with the powertrain is much more complex but not fair to say you can't change the body, wheels etc

Hey - maybe Ford could copy that idea and launch a Capri Coupe and Capri Convertible

NBLondon

DullGreyGuy said:

NBLondon said:
That's another point about the classic though - you can (if you know what you're doing) upgrade them later and swap bits about.  Bet no-one can do that with the EV version...

You can't? Dont remember Tesla doing a 2 door convertible Model S? There's also a CyberTruck on snow tracks out there too. 

Sure, its harder to tinker with the powertrain is much more complex but not fair to say you can't change the body, wheels etc

Was that done by Joe Bloggs and his pal in a lock-up?  I think not...  I was picking up on Mouldy's suggestion that someone had taken an old Capri 1.3 and put a 3.0 engine in it.   People have also put various Mustang sourced engines under the bonnet as well.    I'm suggesting it is much less likely that in 10 years time someone will have a 2024 Capri and be able to replace the powertrain with something more powerful or more up to date.

WellKnownSid

NBLondon said:

DullGreyGuy said:

NBLondon said:
That's another point about the classic though - you can (if you know what you're doing) upgrade them later and swap bits about.  Bet no-one can do that with the EV version...

You can't? Dont remember Tesla doing a 2 door convertible Model S? There's also a CyberTruck on snow tracks out there too. 

Sure, its harder to tinker with the powertrain is much more complex but not fair to say you can't change the body, wheels etc

Was that done by Joe Bloggs and his pal in a lock-up?  I think not...  I was picking up on Mouldy's suggestion that someone had taken an old Capri 1.3 and put a 3.0 engine in it.   People have also put various Mustang sourced engines under the bonnet as well.    I'm suggesting it is much less likely that in 10 years time someone will have a 2024 Capri and be able to replace the powertrain with something more powerful or more up to date.

There are so many videos of hacked Teslas, Tesla V8s and [insert old car] having been given a Tesla powertrain.  I've even seen someone pulling the battery from a Leaf on his drive with the whole car supported on bricks.

Plus these days, it's less about Joe Bloggs getting oily with engine swap, much of the tinkering is now with Joe Bloggs on his laptop.  You only have to look at the hundreds of back street 'bike shops' in London that can 'lift the restrictions' in e-bikes and electric scooters by hacking the software to see the direction this is heading...

If you don't care about the the battery pack or motor life - I'm pretty sure even the new Capri could get Ludicrous mode with the right software...

caprikid1

"If you don't care about the the battery pack or motor life - I'm pretty sure even the new Capri could get Ludicrous mode with the right software..."

But it would still be dull... I'll stick with mine

NBLondon

WellKnownSid said:

Plus these days, it's less about Joe Bloggs getting oily with engine swap, much of the tinkering is now with Joe Bloggs on his laptop.  You only have to look at the hundreds of back street 'bike shops' in London that can 'lift the restrictions' in e-bikes and electric scooters by hacking the software to see the direction this is heading...

If you don't care about the the battery pack or motor life - I'm pretty sure even the new Capri could get Ludicrous mode with the right software...

You're right - that's the next step after reprograming the ECU in a 21st Century hot hatch.  I expect the manufacturers are taking precautions against it but given time, someone will obtain the access codes.   Right now, it's in their financial interest to make sure only main dealers can work on their EVs and it's prohibitively expensive for independent garages to set up/ get the training etc.

Grumpy_chap

NBLondon said:

WellKnownSid said:

Plus these days, it's less about Joe Bloggs getting oily with engine swap, much of the tinkering is now with Joe Bloggs on his laptop.  You only have to look at the hundreds of back street 'bike shops' in London that can 'lift the restrictions' in e-bikes and electric scooters by hacking the software to see the direction this is heading...

If you don't care about the the battery pack or motor life - I'm pretty sure even the new Capri could get Ludicrous mode with the right software...

You're right - that's the next step after reprograming the ECU in a 21st Century hot hatch.  I expect the manufacturers are taking precautions against it but given time, someone will obtain the access codes.   Right now, it's in their financial interest to make sure only main dealers can work on their EVs and it's prohibitively expensive for independent garages to set up/ get the training etc.

I am not sure that reprogramming an EV is as simple as changing the ECU software or overriding the restrictions on an e-bike / scooter.
My car now receives software updates over the air.  I assume that, if the car detected an altered version of software, the OTA update would be a full reinstall of compliant software rather than an update.

WellKnownSid

Grumpy_chap said:

NBLondon said:

WellKnownSid said:

Plus these days, it's less about Joe Bloggs getting oily with engine swap, much of the tinkering is now with Joe Bloggs on his laptop.  You only have to look at the hundreds of back street 'bike shops' in London that can 'lift the restrictions' in e-bikes and electric scooters by hacking the software to see the direction this is heading...

If you don't care about the the battery pack or motor life - I'm pretty sure even the new Capri could get Ludicrous mode with the right software...

You're right - that's the next step after reprograming the ECU in a 21st Century hot hatch.  I expect the manufacturers are taking precautions against it but given time, someone will obtain the access codes.   Right now, it's in their financial interest to make sure only main dealers can work on their EVs and it's prohibitively expensive for independent garages to set up/ get the training etc.

I am not sure that reprogramming an EV is as simple as changing the ECU software or overriding the restrictions on an e-bike / scooter.
My car now receives software updates over the air.  I assume that, if the car detected an altered version of software, the OTA update would be a full reinstall of compliant software rather than an update.

Well then strip out the computer.  At its most basic level your car is just a big battery, some wires, a three-phase inverter, a motor, an angular resolver, and a 0-5v input for requested power.

Obviously you'll have a few warning lights on and some of the courtesy features like brakes might not work as intended, but it's just meccano...

NBLondon

Grumpy_chap said:

My car now receives software updates over the air.  I assume that, if the car detected an altered version of software, the OTA update would be a full reinstall of compliant software rather than an update.

I'm not sure I'd be keen on OTA updates.  You're right - it would probably fail at the next update.  Or if you were getting updates with main dealer services - it would come up then.  And any guarantee would be invalidated at that point.  Maybe 5-10 years down the line there will be semi-specialists who have the access codes (former dealer technicians?) who can keep the hack going.

WellKnownSid said:

Well then strip out the computer.  At its most basic level your car is just a big battery, some wires, a three-phase inverter, a motor, an angular resolver, and a 0-5v input for requested power.
Obviously you'll have a few warning lights on and some of the courtesy features like brakes might not work as intended, but it's just meccano...

That's probably the process behind using the powertrain from a crashed Tesla or Leaf or whatever to electrify a classic. You don't need the ECU connections and the ABS and so on... So it might be feasible to get a good classic Capri bodyshell, throwaway the engine/gearbox and substitute EV powertrain. Bonus - if the batteries go in the boot, that weight improves the handling without the need for the traditional bag of cement. It just wouldn't sound right.