FIXED PENALTY NOTICE FOR CIGARETTE BUTT

Pollycat

HillStreetBlues said:

Undervalued said:

HillStreetBlues said:

Undervalued said:

Plus, did you actually drop the cigarette butt as alleged? If not, your post does you no favours as it tends to give the impression you are looking for a technicality! 

This is a MSE site, so not paying a fine (or a penalty) that you legally don't have to would certainly be classed as money saving.
I would avoid the parking-tickets-fines-parking

Maybe.

However some members, me included, may well be less inclined to help those who are actually "guilty" whilst quite happy to devote our time to helping those falsely accused!

But it's very simple not to help someone if you feel that way inclined, you don't post.
Nothing wrong with asking if they did drop it (as you then can choose to help ot not ),  but waiting for the answer would be the wises action.

Asked several times but not answered...

LindsayT

I feel Undervalued undermined my integrity at the first opportunity, so I will leave it there.
Apologies to other people who commented.
For those of you who asked if I did drop it, read my first post and you will find the answer.

Aylesbury_Duck

LindsayT said:

I feel Undervalued undermined my integrity at the first opportunity, so I will leave it there.
Apologies to other people who commented.
For those of you who asked if I did drop it, read my first post and you will find the answer.

It was a perfectly valid and pertinent question, and no, the answer isn't in your first post.  You very carefully avoided confirming whether or not you had dropped the butt, and haven't answered the perfectly reasonable question that came later.  It's difficult to advise someone who's deliberately evasive because it makes us doubt what else in your account might be amended or omitted in order to get the answer you want.

If you did drop it, and were seen to do so, that might make your appeal a little trickier than if, as you seem to be saying (but not confirming) you didn't and the FPN was issued unfairly.  I don't care either way, but the advice I'd give would be different for each situation.

km1500

since you did not drop it and the enforcement officer is clearly wrong I would wait until it is taken to court and put your evidence to the judge who will make a decision based on that

HillStreetBlues

LindsayT said:

For those of you who asked if I did drop it, read my first post and you will find the answer.

It's not totally clear as can be open to interpretation.

I showed him the travel ashtray I have in my bag with a butt in it.

Was it thee butt? As it could read as a random butt.

You don't have to answer, totally up to you  but as you will have noted you may get more help if it's thee butt.

HillStreetBlues

Pollycat said:

HillStreetBlues said:

Undervalued said:

HillStreetBlues said:

Undervalued said:

Plus, did you actually drop the cigarette butt as alleged? If not, your post does you no favours as it tends to give the impression you are looking for a technicality! 

This is a MSE site, so not paying a fine (or a penalty) that you legally don't have to would certainly be classed as money saving.
I would avoid the parking-tickets-fines-parking

Maybe.

However some members, me included, may well be less inclined to help those who are actually "guilty" whilst quite happy to devote our time to helping those falsely accused!

But it's very simple not to help someone if you feel that way inclined, you don't post.
Nothing wrong with asking if they did drop it (as you then can choose to help ot not ),  but waiting for the answer would be the wises action.

Asked several times but not answered...

The OP thinks the question as been answered, but the wording makes it a bit unambiguous and don't personally feel that was the intention (could be wrong thou).

fatbelly

Actually the defence is to 'drop and leave'

If the op dropped it, then picked it up and put it in the travel ashtray then he is not guilty of any offence

S87 of EPA 1990

https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1990/43/section/87?view=plain#:~:text=87 Offence of leaving litter. E+W [ F1,to the air, subject to subsection (3) below.

I suggest he defends on that basis.

Aylesbury_Duck

fatbelly said:

Actually the defence is to 'drop and leave'

If the op dropped it, then picked it up and put it in the travel ashtray then he is not guilty of any offence

S87 of EPA 1990

Thanks.  Looks like we'll never know, though.  All very odd.

Pollycat

HillStreetBlues said:

Pollycat said:

HillStreetBlues said:

Undervalued said:

HillStreetBlues said:

Undervalued said:

Plus, did you actually drop the cigarette butt as alleged? If not, your post does you no favours as it tends to give the impression you are looking for a technicality! 

This is a MSE site, so not paying a fine (or a penalty) that you legally don't have to would certainly be classed as money saving.
I would avoid the parking-tickets-fines-parking

Maybe.

However some members, me included, may well be less inclined to help those who are actually "guilty" whilst quite happy to devote our time to helping those falsely accused!

But it's very simple not to help someone if you feel that way inclined, you don't post.
Nothing wrong with asking if they did drop it (as you then can choose to help ot not ),  but waiting for the answer would be the wises action.

Asked several times but not answered...

The OP thinks the question as been answered, but the wording makes it a bit unambiguous and don't personally feel that was the intention (could be wrong thou).

But it hasn't been answered.
A simple 'yes, I did drop it' or 'no I didn't drop it'.

Why be ambiguous?

HillStreetBlues

Pollycat said:

HillStreetBlues said:

Pollycat said:

HillStreetBlues said:

Undervalued said:

HillStreetBlues said:

Undervalued said:

Plus, did you actually drop the cigarette butt as alleged? If not, your post does you no favours as it tends to give the impression you are looking for a technicality! 

This is a MSE site, so not paying a fine (or a penalty) that you legally don't have to would certainly be classed as money saving.
I would avoid the parking-tickets-fines-parking

Maybe.

However some members, me included, may well be less inclined to help those who are actually "guilty" whilst quite happy to devote our time to helping those falsely accused!

But it's very simple not to help someone if you feel that way inclined, you don't post.
Nothing wrong with asking if they did drop it (as you then can choose to help ot not ),  but waiting for the answer would be the wises action.

Asked several times but not answered...

The OP thinks the question as been answered, but the wording makes it a bit unambiguous and don't personally feel that was the intention (could be wrong thou).

But it hasn't been answered.
A simple 'yes, I did drop it' or 'no I didn't drop it'.

Why be ambiguous?

Maybe the OP didn't realise and thought the question had already been answered so it was other posters not reading the opening post.
No one pointed out it was  when asking that the reason they were asking that opening post was unclear.
Since that's been pointed out  the OP hasn't been back.