Octopus saving sessions

mmmmikey

bristolleedsfan said:

MultiFuelBurner said:

SuzeQStan said:

MultiFuelBurner said:

mjm3346 said:

MultiFuelBurner said:

mjm3346 said:

SuzeQStan said:

TheElectricCow said:

The next round of tests are slightly different in that if high enough participation levels are expected NGESO will be operating the tests with “competitive” pricing rather than the standard £3/kWh the tests have paid out up to this point (translates to £2.25/kWh for Octopus customers).

They didnt exactly pay a fortune the last lot of sessions - I can see interest in participation waning if rewards decreased further - at least for myself anyway 😊

Probably why they do what many "reward" sites do and reward in points because say a massive 200 point bonus seems more than a measly 25p reward.

For replier and @SuzeQStan

And yet they all add up and that 25p may knock 2-4p off your electricity kWh price for that day. Then on the days of the saving events even 50p may knock off 4-8p for that days kWh price.

Something people normally wouldn't scoff at it's more likely people don't want to conform and use less during those times. The "I'm not listening when to use electricity for" type of view.

Just by way of example the saving sessions this December and all these 200/200/400 bonus points have reduced our December bill by 17%. 

I don't disagree they add up (and I do it for the cash value) but the 3 bonus payments are worth £1 while they choose to say 800 points, they are by no means the only site where a massive number of points is quoted instead of a cash value presumably for the same reasons both to encourage users and make direct comparisons less easy.

There are almost certainly people lured in by the number of points who wouldn't bother if the actual cash value was given 

Really that's just good for the planet I don't care if it's 8million points for a £1 it's less CO² released. Less coal or gas burnt to fulfill the requirement.

Is it really less coal or gas burnt etc if the usage load is just shifted to a different time or day?

Yes and who says it is all shifted? We turn off our ASHP and when it comes back on it doesn't use twice the energy. Same for lights they don't work twice as hard when you turn them back on. The TV doesn't suddenly use twice the power because it was off for an hour etc etc.

......................

This is extracted from a thread I started suggesting a way you might be able to get an hours effectively free electricity at peak times through load shifting, vaguely along the lines of using the in day adjustment period last year. But no guarantee it will work, as it depends on correctly predicting the timing and frequency of future sessions and how easily you can load shift. Low risk as long as you do it intelligently though.

It would be fair to say the thread wasn't universally well received - but more info here if you're interested....

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/6493582/free-electric-heating-for-an-hour-a-day-mon-fri-when-you-come-home-from-work#latest

( ps note use of words "effectively free" and please leave your rhubarb alone - you'll have to read the thread to understand this reference.....)

mjm3346

MultiFuelBurner said:

SuzeQStan said:

MultiFuelBurner said:

mjm3346 said:

MultiFuelBurner said:

mjm3346 said:

SuzeQStan said:

TheElectricCow said:

The next round of tests are slightly different in that if high enough participation levels are expected NGESO will be operating the tests with “competitive” pricing rather than the standard £3/kWh the tests have paid out up to this point (translates to £2.25/kWh for Octopus customers).

They didnt exactly pay a fortune the last lot of sessions - I can see interest in participation waning if rewards decreased further - at least for myself anyway 😊

Probably why they do what many "reward" sites do and reward in points because say a massive 200 point bonus seems more than a measly 25p reward.

For replier and @SuzeQStan

And yet they all add up and that 25p may knock 2-4p off your electricity kWh price for that day. Then on the days of the saving events even 50p may knock off 4-8p for that days kWh price.

Something people normally wouldn't scoff at it's more likely people don't want to conform and use less during those times. The "I'm not listening when to use electricity for" type of view.

Just by way of example the saving sessions this December and all these 200/200/400 bonus points have reduced our December bill by 17%. 

I don't disagree they add up (and I do it for the cash value) but the 3 bonus payments are worth £1 while they choose to say 800 points, they are by no means the only site where a massive number of points is quoted instead of a cash value presumably for the same reasons both to encourage users and make direct comparisons less easy.

There are almost certainly people lured in by the number of points who wouldn't bother if the actual cash value was given 

Really that's just good for the planet I don't care if it's 8million points for a £1 it's less CO² released. Less coal or gas burnt to fulfill the requirement.

Is it really less coal or gas burnt etc if the usage load is just shifted to a different time or day?

Yes and who says it is all shifted? We turn off our ASHP and when it comes back on it doesn't use twice the energy. Same for lights they don't work twice as hard when you turn them back on. The TV doesn't suddenly use twice the power because it was off for an hour etc etc.

Most of mine is shifted - normal usage (tv, router, fridge etc) comes in at less than 0.1kWh, highest 1/2 hour yesterday usage was 0.704kWh when cooking so that and all the high usage (for me) is shifted on saving days but the 0.1 is saved as I shut the power off at the meter and as said above there is no catchup usage for TV, Router etc 

SuzeQStan

So I’ve probably got this completely wrong - however have to ask:

if someone decides to use more energy between 5-6pm on a regular basis in order to increase session earnings when they come in - aren’t they burning more coal & dirty energy when consumption is highest and most polluting on all those other days in order to make more
money on one day’s saving session?

mjm3346

SuzeQStan said:

So I’ve probably got this completely wrong - however have to ask:

if someone decides to use more energy between 5-6pm on a regular basis in order to increase session earnings when they come in - aren’t they burning more coal & dirty energy when consumption is highest and most polluting on all those other days in order to make more
money on one day’s saving session?

I think the idea is that peak usage remains below the need for "dirty stuff" on non-saving days regardless of a bit of shifting. (the weather can make a far bigger difference)

Spoonie_Turtle

SuzeQStan said:

So I’ve probably got this completely wrong - however have to ask:

if someone decides to use more energy between 5-6pm on a regular basis in order to increase session earnings when they come in - aren’t they burning more coal & dirty energy when consumption is highest and most polluting on all those other days in order to make more
money on one day’s saving session?

Pretty much, in theory.  Although also in theory on the non SS days presumably the dirtiest energy is less dirty than the peak on SS days.

Someone would have to sift through the actual data to compare the reality of the various different days, though.  Definitely not me!

MultiFuelBurner

On "emergency" events (the ones where you get paid more) they are stoking up the coal burning facilities so any shifting to another day/ another time is welcome away from the peak demand period.and will save harmful emissions and high costs to buy in electricity.

For us that's not a hard sell but it does seem that part isn't emphasized enough and to change habits everyone wants lots of £'s for it to be worthwhile to them.

That's why something harsher will have to be introduced to ween people off the bigger polluting fuels.

bristolleedsfan

MultiFuelBurner said:

I don't know if Octopus are pocketing the 75p from each kWh saved or putting it back in for the good of everyone. But historically I suggest they appear to be an above board supplier. 

Octo Chief reply makes me think they are happy for gullible to become more gullible, no mention bonus points coming from cut they are taking which some other providers most notably energy suppliers often referred to as dinosaurs are not taking.

https://twitter.com/EcoNorfolk/status/1738225565893890321

masonic

bristolleedsfan said:

MultiFuelBurner said:

I don't know if Octopus are pocketing the 75p from each kWh saved or putting it back in for the good of everyone. But historically I suggest they appear to be an above board supplier. 

Octo Chief reply makes me think they are happy for gullible to become more gullible, no mention bonus points coming from cut they are taking which some other providers most notably energy suppliers often referred to as dinosaurs are not taking.

Originally, the reduced payout rate funded the spot prizes, so we were all effectively being entered into a lottery to the tune of 75p/kWh. It's unclear whether the bonus Octopoints are funded from the same pot or not. However, bonuses and extras paid out by BG and others have been more generous.

If there is any evidence of impropriety (Octopus pocketing any of the money paid by the scheme), then that would be very interesting to see.

mmmmikey

bristolleedsfan said:

MultiFuelBurner said:

I don't know if Octopus are pocketing the 75p from each kWh saved or putting it back in for the good of everyone. But historically I suggest they appear to be an above board supplier. 

Octo Chief reply makes me think they are happy for gullible to become more gullible, no mention bonus points coming from cut they are taking which some other providers most notably energy suppliers often referred to as dinosaurs are not taking.

https://twitter.com/EcoNorfolk/status/1738225565893890321

Surely the gullible ones are the customers paying the big suppliers more day in day out who think they are getting a good deal because the savings scheme they are part of is more generous? In many cases they'll quite literally be spending hundreds of pounds to make pennies, but each to their own :-)

And surely all Octopus are doing is what every responsible and sustainable business does - taking a cut to offset their costs? And doing this transparently rather than hiding the costs elsewhere? 

MultiFuelBurner

mmmmikey said:

bristolleedsfan said:

MultiFuelBurner said:

I don't know if Octopus are pocketing the 75p from each kWh saved or putting it back in for the good of everyone. But historically I suggest they appear to be an above board supplier. 

Octo Chief reply makes me think they are happy for gullible to become more gullible, no mention bonus points coming from cut they are taking which some other providers most notably energy suppliers often referred to as dinosaurs are not taking.

https://twitter.com/EcoNorfolk/status/1738225565893890321

Surely the gullible ones are the customers paying the big suppliers more day in day out who think they are getting a good deal because the savings scheme they are part of is more generous? In many cases they'll quite literally be spending hundreds of pounds to make pennies, but each to their own :-)

And surely all Octopus are doing is what every responsible and sustainable business does - taking a cut to offset their costs? And doing this transparently rather than hiding the costs elsewhere? 

I second this.