Help needed: multiple tickets in a row for parking outside my own house

happysoul99

Dear All,

I have been living in a residential area for many years. Each property has their own allocated space, but there is plenty of available parking spaces on unlined roads for some of us who own an additional vehicle. Most of the residents in my estate do.

The estate management company has recently introduced parking restrictions on one of the roads. The private parking management company has been engaged to implement this and they've been putting up confusing signs. 

None of the residents living in the area (except for the ones on the actual road which is adjacent to mine) have been informed about such restrictions and neither did they advertise the day these would start being enforced.

Suddenly about 3 weeks after these signs were put up they've started issuing PCN's via the post. Most people didn't even realise that the enforcement had commenced until they started receiving tickets through the post.

The residents of the adjacent streets whose road was now restricted but appear to have known about the enforcement date, started parking on our road, rather than pay for a resident permit which was now required of them.

Needless to say we parked on their road. What followed was carnage (pun intended). That unlined road is now completely empty, whereas the adjacent roads are now completely full.

I digress, but what I am left with now is a number of PCNs issued by a private parking firm who are a member of IPC. 

I have appealed one of the tickets in anger, where I described the situation: i.e. not knowing about this sudden change and appealed for them to have understanding and cancel the tickets.

Having read the newbies forum, I later understood that I didn't do the appeal correctly. I didn't include any information on how the signs were confusing, the charges for example were hidden in the small print, the only prominent lettering displayed "Private Land" which we all knew to be the case all along. I also imply in the appeal that I was the driver (I wasn't, it was my missus but she had no idea either).

Reading the Newbies forum I understand that appealing to IAS/IPC regulated Parking firms is pointless. 

What do you suggest that I do? Should I appeal all the other PCN's? And if I do, would my previous appeal undermine my new appeal for the other tickets issued under similar circumstances?

How likely am I to win in court should these make it that far? And would this be a single court case or multiple for each PCN?

many thanks for you time reading this,

yours sincerely

Umkomaas

Which parking firm is issuing the tickets?

happysoul99

Umkomaas said:

Which parking firm is issuing the tickets?

Parking&Property Management Ltd

Umkomaas

happysoul99 said:

Umkomaas said:

Which parking firm is issuing the tickets?

Parking&Property Management Ltd

Litigious outfit, so in due course you can anticipate a court claim (or claims). Should be just the one, but the sausage machines of the roboclaim solicitors don't necessarily recognise duplicate cases and churn out separate claims.  Check out 'cause of action estoppel' and 'Henderson v Henderson'. 

Ordinarily we don't often recommend appealing to IPC parking operators, but given who you're dealing with, and the possibility of a claim(s), I'd go through the motions of appealing, just using the template in the NEWBIES FAQ Announcement, first post.  This way, you can show to a judge that you did engage in their processes in an attempt to resolve the issues. 

Whilst a bit of a PITA, send a separate appeal for each ticket. Why not add a parking-related, but different question at the end of each appeal, to really check if they've read it and answered before their usual template rejection. That might show a judge they've hardly given any time or consideration in rejecting. 

Do the appeals on line, chronologically, but before each of the individual 21-day expiry dates, to drag this out a bit.

How many tickets have been issued to you?

happysoul99

Thank you for your advice.

I have been issued 7 in total. Three of which have come through the post, but when I called them they told me I had four more in the works.

I feel like they've purposely chosen to not slap PCN's on the windshield so that they could maximise their profits. Had people seem the tickets they would have stopped parking there.

Several other residents are in the same position as me, so I will share this advice with them.

happysoul99

I am a little worried that the costs (including the court costs) may balloon beyond what I can afford to pay should I lose in the end. What are my odds here?

Umkomaas

Several other residents are in the same position as me, so I will share this advice with them.

Set up a Facebook or WhatsApp group to involve all the victims of this, so you can easily keep everyone informed of progress and to discuss strategies. 

happysoul99 said:

I am a little worried that the costs (including the court costs) may balloon beyond what I can afford to pay should I lose in the end. What are my odds here?

It's very difficult to provide 'odds', individual courts are their own masters and predicting outcomes is a fool's game. But, the overwhelmingly majority of cases supported by this forum have been won by the motorist.  Even in the event of unlikely losses, motorists have found that the amounts claimed by litigation-rampant parking firms are pared back quite viciously by judges.

Grizebeck

I wonder what the kick is worth to the estate management firm

Coupon-mad

happysoul99 said:

Thank you for your advice.

I have been issued 7 in total. Three of which have come through the post, but when I called them they told me I had four more in the works.

I feel like they've purposely chosen to not slap PCN's on the windshield so that they could maximise their profits. Had people seem the tickets they would have stopped parking there.

Several other residents are in the same position as me, so I will share this advice with them.

Get your MP on board to make complaints to PPM, the IPC and the landowners.  That works.

And get it in the paper, like this:
https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/80128640/#Comment_80128640

I am a little worried that the costs (including the court costs) may balloon beyond what I can afford to pay should I lose in the end. What are my odds here?

We see 99% wins and we know what we are doing.

There are no high costs at stake; you don't pay solicitors' costs in small claims. I bet you imagined hundreds in costs. Wrong.

Why do you think we do this every day? No-one is put at risk of CCJs or ballooning costs and even the odd person who loses in court pays LESS THAN THE CLAIM!

No CCJ.

Here's a typical win from today already:
https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/80144190/#Comment_80144190

Yesterday we had three out of three!  About half of cases are about scam operators at residential sites with not enough notice and poor signage.

Please tell your neighbours this.  They can copy & paste our resources, it is easy.  We defend parking claims EVERY DAY on MSE. There's no risk, especially given the direction of travel of the new law. Huge changes are nearly there.

The Government is believed likely to ban the fake added 'debt recovery fee' (£60 or £70 per PCN) and that will be announced in July!  This will stop court claims in their current bulk.

The DLUHC banned it in 2022 but it's a long story.

Please publicise with your neighbours when the DLUHC's Public Consultation opens next month AND mention it to your MP when asking them to weigh in.

Explained here a year ago:
https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/79310609/#Comment_79310609

The Consultation is coming out in weeks and we need ALL affected to drown out the responses by parking firms!

happysoul99

Grizebeck said:

I wonder what the kick is worth to the estate management firm

Quite a bit I assume, since they were not wiling to listen at all.

happysoul99

Umkomaas said:

Several other residents are in the same position as me, so I will share this advice with them.

Set up a Facebook or WhatsApp group to involve all the victims of this, so you can easily keep everyone informed of progress and to discuss strategies. 

happysoul99 said:

I am a little worried that the costs (including the court costs) may balloon beyond what I can afford to pay should I lose in the end. What are my odds here?

It's very difficult to provide 'odds', individual courts are their own masters and predicting outcomes is a fool's game. But, the overwhelmingly majority of cases supported by this forum have been won by the motorist.  Even in the event of unlikely losses, motorists have found that the amounts claimed by litigation-rampant parking firms are pared back quite viciously by judges.

Thank you!

I will do what you've suggested: appeal each ticket using the template in the newbies with an added paragraph to differentiate each scenario.

Needless to say, should they reject it, shall I continue appealing to IAS, or let them initiate court proceedings?