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Why are people so disparaging about IHDs?

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  • Xbigman
    Xbigman Posts: 3,915 Forumite
    Part of the Furniture 1,000 Posts Name Dropper Combo Breaker
    The whole set up of the IHD is flawed. Cost is a variable but consumption is fixed. A Kilowatt contains 1000 watts. It doesn't go down to 890 watts because inflation is 10.1% nor does it go up to 1100 watts because the government is subsidising it. Over time the only measure that matters is consumption. 
    Its almost like the IHD designers knew it was a gimmick with no long term appeal.



    Darren
    Xbigman's guide to a happy life.

    Eat properly
    Sleep properly
    Save some money
  • Mstty
    Mstty Posts: 4,209 Forumite
    1,000 Posts First Anniversary Photogenic Name Dropper
    There is probably a case for those believing the IHD cost and budgeting accordingly.......not knowing it hasn't updated the correct current rates.

    Yes I know we all know it's kWh that count and we can all use our spreadsheets but it's long been established there are parts of the population that struggle with this particular mathematics issue especially when you add in cubic feet/meters and calorific values for gas calculations.

    That's why some of us are here to help when those that need it pop onto the forum.
  • Sea_Shell
    Sea_Shell Posts: 10,016 Forumite
    Tenth Anniversary 1,000 Posts Photogenic Name Dropper
    edited 25 October 2023 at 9:41PM
    RG2015 said:
    Dolor said:
    Swipe said:
    Dolor said:
    Sea_Shell said:
    Sea_Shell said:
    Just looked...and it appears to have updated now.   Well the gas definitely has, as that's an obvious difference. (I didn't have all the figures to hand)

    So, if anyone's with Eon and their IHD rates aren't right, drop them a quick email.


    I spoke too soon!!!!   :p

    Having checked them more closely, yes, the rates have updated, but ONLY to the standard OFGEM cap rates (I think) and not the discounted EPG rates.

    We SHOULD be on, as per our Eon account:

    Elec: 32.4p
    s/c: 29.11p
    Gas: 10.18p
    s/c: 50.31p


    BUT

    The IHD is now showing...

    Elec: 35.05p
    s/c: 34.33p
    Gas: 10.84p
    s/c: 56.7p


    Am I right in thinking these ARE the un-discounted DD rates (East Midlands)?
    Suppliers will normally set the meter tariff rates without  any discount as the EPG doesn’t change the tariff: it just changes what the supplier can charge. The EPG may be applied separately on any bills.
    My EDF meter updated this week to the discounted tariff rates when my fix ended. What's the point of the IHD if the prices on there are not correct?
    We are back to where this thread started. The Government could remove the EPG tomorrow. Some suppliers raise a bill based on the non-discounted tariff and apply the EPG as a billing discount. Others chose to bill at the EPG discounted rate. Suppliers pay the DCC each time that it sends instructions to each meter so it may suit them just to apply the actual tariff which wouldn’t change if the EPG is removed.
    This doesn’t explain E.ON Next though.

    Sea_Shell and I are both with E.ON Next, but my IHD has the EPG rate and their’s had the non discounted rate.

    Furthermore, my bill is at the full rate with the discount deducted at the end,


    We've received our bill.   It is as expected (from my own calculations)


    It shows an EPG discount off the Next flex unit rates only (not the s/c) and so still doesn't match with what the IHD says.  

    The Gas, for example is shown on the bill as 11.884p less discount of 2.19p, plus VAT = 10.178p  
    Standing Charge of 27.726p, (no discount) plus VAT. = 29.11p


    So I now have no idea what the figures the IHD is using relate to!!  :D

    Ho hum.  



    How's it going, AKA, Nutwatch? - 12 month spends to date = 2.60% of current retirement "pot" (as at end May 2025)
  • Chrysalis said:
    I think IHD's would be better without cost been quoted, used for usage, not tariff or billing information.

    I also think the octopus mini should be how it should have been from the start, I find it much better than the IHD I received.

    For those who dont know, Octopus are trialling a product which sends usage information to your phone for the current day and live watts usage.  So no need to be sitting next to a IHD display, and with it being an app, it means octopus can provide software updates when needed.

    I am really surprised that the system for getting data off the HAN was not better designed, if they had made it accessible by user paring, over Zigbee, Bluetooth etc. then it would have solved a lot of issues, would have allowed a PC to draw down data easily etc. The data accessibility at the local level seems flawed.
    Our smart meter system is deliberately locked down for security reasons as there is the potential for a malign actor to cause considerable long-term damage to the National Grid if our smart meters are disconnected from the Grid en masse.

    https://www.ncsc.gov.uk/information/the-smart-security-behind-the-gb-smart-metering-system
  • RG2015
    RG2015 Posts: 6,048 Forumite
    Ninth Anniversary 1,000 Posts Name Dropper Photogenic
    edited 6 May 2023 at 8:49AM
    As stated before, the E.ON Next data for me is correct.

    My electricity tariff inc VAT is £0.3240 / kWh and s/c is £0.5031 / day.

    My IHD has 32.4p and 50.3p and my latest bill is as follows.




  • Xbigman
    Xbigman Posts: 3,915 Forumite
    Part of the Furniture 1,000 Posts Name Dropper Combo Breaker

    Yes I know we all know it's kWh that count and we can all use our spreadsheets but it's long been established there are parts of the population that struggle with this particular mathematics issue especially when you add in cubic feet/meters and calorific values for gas calculations.

    That's why some of us are here to help when those that need it pop onto the forum.

    This is one of the reasons its flawed. Because some people struggle we are all treated like that. Everything in this country is dumbed down thus pushing everyone to be dumb. The IHD should default to consumption with the option to use cost for those that find that useful.

    However my main point is still valid. If you look back at what you've paid without knowing consumption its pretty meaningless. 


    Darren
    Xbigman's guide to a happy life.

    Eat properly
    Sleep properly
    Save some money
  • Chrysalis
    Chrysalis Posts: 4,703 Forumite
    Part of the Furniture 1,000 Posts Photogenic Name Dropper
    victor2 said:
    Chrysalis said:
    I think IHD's would be better without cost been quoted, used for usage, not tariff or billing information.

    ....

    While I agree because the cost indicated will never quite match exactly what is billed, people aren't really interested in kWh usage, they want to know the cost.
    For example, we've just got a new "smart" appliance, which uses  a small amount of power 24/7. I've monitored what its use has been overnight and the kWh figure means nothing to my OH. All she wants to know is the cost and therefore potential saving by not having it on standby.

    Maybe IHD's would be more useful showing historical billed cost, with the ability to average that out over the billing period, but then people would have to typically wait a month to see the effect of their efforts to save, assuming kWh figures meant little to them - and that's before you try to explain how gas volume used is converted to kWh for billing purposes!


    Well the app does show your bills, so as such the cost, unlike the IHD's its accurate.
  • dealyboy
    dealyboy Posts: 1,930 Forumite
    Part of the Furniture 1,000 Posts Photogenic Name Dropper
    @Xbigman said:

    Yes I know we all know it's kWh that count and we can all use our spreadsheets but it's long been established there are parts of the population that struggle with this particular mathematics issue especially when you add in cubic feet/meters and calorific values for gas calculations.

    That's why some of us are here to help when those that need it pop onto the forum.

    This is one of the reasons its flawed. Because some people struggle we are all treated like that. Everything in this country is dumbed down thus pushing everyone to be dumb. The IHD should default to consumption with the option to use cost for those that find that useful.

    However my main point is still valid. If you look back at what you've paid without knowing consumption its pretty meaningless. 


    Darren
    ... mine does ... if what you are referring to is real time electrical power usage. In fact it shows both the usage and the cost per hour underneath in small point size. For other consumption figures (energy, cost, time periods etc) I need to select the calendar button or menu.

    As already stated the figures are accurate; the IHD presents information using data from the SMETS 2 meter which I can interrogate to obtain the raw data for E7 splits.

    It might help to reboot the IHD.

    I am electricity only.
  • RG2015
    RG2015 Posts: 6,048 Forumite
    Ninth Anniversary 1,000 Posts Name Dropper Photogenic
    Chrysalis said:
    victor2 said:
    Chrysalis said:
    I think IHD's would be better without cost been quoted, used for usage, not tariff or billing information.

    ....

    While I agree because the cost indicated will never quite match exactly what is billed, people aren't really interested in kWh usage, they want to know the cost.
    For example, we've just got a new "smart" appliance, which uses  a small amount of power 24/7. I've monitored what its use has been overnight and the kWh figure means nothing to my OH. All she wants to know is the cost and therefore potential saving by not having it on standby.

    Maybe IHD's would be more useful showing historical billed cost, with the ability to average that out over the billing period, but then people would have to typically wait a month to see the effect of their efforts to save, assuming kWh figures meant little to them - and that's before you try to explain how gas volume used is converted to kWh for billing purposes!


    Well the app does show your bills, so as such the cost, unlike the IHD's its accurate.
    Once again, a blanket statement is being made.

    I can categorically say that my IHD is accurate and I suspect that I am not the only one.

    It is incorrect to imply that IHDs are not accurate.

    All you can say is that some IHDs are inaccurate. Possibly with evidence you could say that many IHDs are inaccurate.


  • victor2
    victor2 Posts: 8,120 Ambassador
    Part of the Furniture 1,000 Posts Name Dropper
    RG2015 said:
    Chrysalis said:
    victor2 said:
    Chrysalis said:
    I think IHD's would be better without cost been quoted, used for usage, not tariff or billing information.

    ....

    While I agree because the cost indicated will never quite match exactly what is billed, people aren't really interested in kWh usage, they want to know the cost.
    For example, we've just got a new "smart" appliance, which uses  a small amount of power 24/7. I've monitored what its use has been overnight and the kWh figure means nothing to my OH. All she wants to know is the cost and therefore potential saving by not having it on standby.

    Maybe IHD's would be more useful showing historical billed cost, with the ability to average that out over the billing period, but then people would have to typically wait a month to see the effect of their efforts to save, assuming kWh figures meant little to them - and that's before you try to explain how gas volume used is converted to kWh for billing purposes!


    Well the app does show your bills, so as such the cost, unlike the IHD's its accurate.
    Once again, a blanket statement is being made.

    I can categorically say that my IHD is accurate and I suspect that I am not the only one.

    It is incorrect to imply that IHDs are not accurate.

    All you can say is that some IHDs are inaccurate. Possibly with evidence you could say that many IHDs are inaccurate.



    It depends on your definition of accurate.
    An IHD will rarely match what a customer is billed to the penny, due to rounding and the way VAT has to be applied. On top of that, the Calorific Value of gas changes daily, which an IHD doesn't show, and then the supplier uses an "average" CV for the entire billing period. We're only talking pennies on a typical monthly bill, but the discrepancy is there.

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