Air Source Heat Pump - Planning permission required!

Mstty

A little chat with the neighbours maybe?

From the plans looks well away from where they are in the house and likely to be in winter when it's running most.

We are in conversation with our neighbours over a multi split A2A system which we know we will have to get planning for as we already have an ASHP.

So far they seem happy and once I talked through the benefits are considering that we both get the systems done at the same time.

However as is usual the planning department don't know their A from their elbow and can't decide what they need from us except they might want a £120 consultancy fee to advise.

matt_drummer

Swipe said:

matt_drummer said:

Swipe said:

It could be during a defrost cycle that the noise is at its highest. I had two Daikin A2A heat pumps and they got much louder during a defrost cycle and got progressively louder as they aged.

Could well be.

I'm not sure if we will ever find out.

Right now I am tempted to forget it and cut my losses.

If I carry on with the planning application I could end up falling out with neighbours over it and I really don't want that.

I don't blame you, especially as you have a fully functioning gas boiler. Sounds like way too much hassle and capital outlay to me. 

It was never about money, it just felt like the right thing to do.

Once the council write to the neighbours and give them the opportunity to object we will have fallen out if they do, whatever the council decide in regard to any objections received.

The question I sit here asking myself is, is it worth the risk?

Even though I think an ASHP is a good idea, it is clear that many don't and lots of people, rightly or wrongly, have concerns over noise. Once given the opportunity to object to something, especially an ASHP, I suspect many people would raise an objection.

I don't know the neighbour concerned, I have never seen them let alone spoken to them. We have lived here since September 2021.

A friendly architect I spoke to suggested I go and speak to them, it feels difficult though.

I really don't know what to do.

What I have picked up on from replies to my post is that there are feelings that the impact any noise may have on a neighbour is more important than environmental consequences of continuing to burn fossil fuels.

I hear the same with electric vehicles, we quite like burning stuff and many of us are reluctant to change unless it's cheaper.

70sbudgie

If you feel uncomfortable knocking on your neighbour's door, put a note through their letter box explaining that you are applying for planning for a HP, with your mobile number. Warning in advance of being notified by the council should help soothe things. (Not guarenteed of course). Communication is always the better option.

matt_drummer

70sbudgie said:

If you feel uncomfortable knocking on your neighbour's door, put a note through their letter box explaining that you are applying for planning for a HP, with your mobile number. Warning in advance of being notified by the council should help soothe things. (Not guarenteed of course). Communication is always the better option.

Well, I bit the bullet and went and spoke to both my neighbours. I explained what we were proposing to do, how it would work and why I needed planning permission.

They are all really interested in what we are doing and would like to do it themselves. They all said they would support the application and have no intention of objecting.

So I will push on with the project.

Alnat1

That's less to worry about now and also you've met your lovely neighbours, well done.

matt_drummer

Whilst I am relieved that they won't object, I am happier about the fact that they are fully in favour of what we are doing.

I was so worried that I would upset someone with this.

matelodave

Mstty said:

matt_drummer said:

Mstty said:

Even though we have one they do look ugly as well so a good placement is also key. Not just to the advantage of orientation of the property owner.

I can see why planning may have stiffened up in some areas but Octopus choice of partner in Daikin may come back to bite them with those dB levels.

I have not chosen a placement to suit me or make installation easier and cheaper, it's going in the only place available at ground level. I could have had it high up on the wall, that would be worse, for my neighbours I suspect

I think ugly is a bit of a strong word, it's just a box.

I think some people are missing the point about the noise, the Daikin heat pump is not guaranteed to be noisier that any other heat pump.

The quoted noise level is the maximum that it can make, not what it will make in my location.

I don't know for sure, but I suspect the maximum noise level quoted is higher because it is capable of working in more extreme environments than some other heat pumps, it works down to -25c and if that is when it is working hardest, that is when it will make the most noise.

Working at 0c, for example, it may well be quieter than other heat pumps.

It is is not necessarily a noisy heat pump.

The problem w is that you have to use the maximum number is the noise calculation, even if it will never be that loud.

Don't take this personally I was just pointing out their are orientations and positions that the heat pump will work more efficiently at so I can see why planning may want to see what wall a heat pump is placed and it's affects on neighbours and if another wall may be better for neighbours but not necessarily for the property owner.

I have one and they are ugly to us, so do our neighbours and they agree they are ugly outside boxes but as they become more common it will just become the norm. 

Octopus have shot themselves in the foot imo.

I cant see that they are much uglier than a ginormous LPG or Oil tank, the same with noise from a boiler.

I can stand next to my 13 year old Daikin ASHP whilst its running and still hear the oil boiler from my neighbour who lives on the opposite side of the road. His boiler is an external unit in a big green box next to his house on his drive together with an even bigger green oil tank, both quite prominently visible from the road. My ASHP is neat and unobtrusive in comparison, the noisiest bit is the water circulation pump inside the hydrobox which is in the utility room (we've got a split unit rather than a monobloc).

TBH its not the compressor or the fan motors tan make the noise but the air blowing through the fan which doesn't seem to be appreciably noisier than the oscillatnig one we have running overnight in the bedroom when it everso hot

Mstty

@matelodave Not to send this off topic but we have had an oil tank and a nice surround with potted plants as access was only needed to the top. Looked great.

You can't cover up or shouldn't cover up your heat pump so imo ugly but if you love yours good for you👍



As for the main thread well done on chatting with the neighbours sounds like it went well👍

matt_drummer

matelodave said:

I cant see that they are much uglier than a ginormous LPG or Oil tank, the same with noise from a boiler.

I can stand next to my 13 year old Daikin ASHP whilst its running and still hear the oil boiler from my neighbour who lives on the opposite side of the road. His boiler is an external unit in a big green box next to his house on his drive together with an even bigger green oil tank, both quite prominently visible from the road. My ASHP is neat and unobtrusive in comparison, the noisiest bit is the water circulation pump inside the hydrobox which is in the utility room (we've got a split unit rather than a monobloc).

TBH its not the compressor or the fan motors tan make the noise but the air blowing through the fan which doesn't seem to be appreciably noisier than the oscillatnig one we have running overnight in the bedroom when it everso hot

Thank you.

Makes sense and I agree completely.

matt_drummer

So, my planning application has been accepted and it is now live.

They have written to all of my neighbours, not just the one that is potentially affected.

The all have 30 days to make their representations.

The council expect a decision by 13 June 2023.

This is exactly the same process as I would have to follow if I was building something like a two storey extension.


I really think the councils need a simpler way to deal with a heat pump installation, all they have at the moment is a full planning application with a prescribed process to be followed.

Perhaps they need a new dedicated procedure for dealing with heat pumps.

Even if all my neighbours tell the council today that they have no objection, we still have to wait for between four and eight weeks for a decision.