UK CPM - new infestation on private estate

_IH8_UKCPM_

On-the-coast said:

Is it different if the car is leased? Looking online it says finance provider is registered keeper and owner with leases and would get sent any fines etc. Does that mean potentially their fines are still finding their way from the finance company to them?

returning to your question above.... in my experience (as someone who's leased cars and received tickets) the letter often takes around 4 weeks to make its way from the originator to the responsible person. To make things worse the lease company often charges around £10 for the service of passing on each letter...   Sorry about that, but extra ammunition for you to use with neighbours.

Thanks. I've gotten in touch with them and just messaged now to advise them if their cars are leased then they might not be aware they are getting ticketed until a lot later.

Half_way

_IH8_UKCPM_ said:

Can I just clarify (again COVID brain so be gentle on me) that I have been understanding correctly MA is referring to management/managing agent? In which case for us it is a large, and as we have unfortunately now learned, notoriously useless company in charge of the estate. I believe they "manage" over 300,000 homes across the UK. Not sure if I should be careful to not reveal their identity on here should they end up searching on here for anything to use against me?

Interestingly the TP1 form from when house first sold lists a different management company who when I look them up on companies house they are linked to endless other estate agents and property management companies. Their current directors were listed as directors for approx 150 other companies all in the property sector. Is this typical? I can't say I know much about business or being a company director.

Is it perhaps that the original company or development was brought out by the big guys we are currently getting bent over by 😂

Just to make things clear, this is a public forum, open for all to see and read, and from what i can see you are in the clear with nothing to hide and no reason to do so.

 so revealing a corporate identity is of no risk, as there is nothing they can use against you, but plenty that you can use against them to ensure that you can use and enjoy your property as it should without fear or worry.

If Parking is an issue on the estate then there are significantly better ways to deal with it than a PPC securing the entrance with a locking gate is one way, as are things such as lockable bollards both of which will deter unwanted parking and improve security.

Mouse007

_IH8_UKCPM_ said:

Is there any guidance anyone can share on getting to the bottom of whether we can remove them and who has the power? Are the particular standard documents the agreements and clauses would be in to cover that? Or is it convoluted system or unique setup that can vary by develoment/estate and management company arrangements and contracts?

I am still unsure who the estate landowner technically is so any guidance on confirming that would be good as well?

Thanks!

I don’t have a picture in my head of your estate. I seam to recall you refer to your house above, not a flat or an apartment.

The last estate I lived on the houses did not share any areas. This was mine, that was yours and everything was connected by adopted roads. Before purchase I did question the open green that the houses were around. Who owns that? What rights, restrictions, covenants etc are in place over that? Owned by neighbours with covenants not to develop, OK I can enjoy that then.

Your starting point must be your deeds, the legal document which sets out what you own and what covenants and easements exist. Your rights over other areas must be defined somewhere.

My current easements include the right to draw water from my neighbours well, currently buried beneath their kitchen floor. Thankfully we have a cat feeding holiday swapping arrangement. I don’t need to dig up their kitchen floor, we like our neighbours. A dog owner would be well advised not to purchase the house next door.

DW190

I will say the management companies name is two words combined.

Word 1 is the position you came in if you win a gold medal

Word 2 is a type of wine produced in a country next to Spain

That would be First Port who appear to be quite large.

Property Management Services - FirstPort

Get all the residents to send them a SAR which should prove that no consultation ever took place.

Le_Kirk

A SAR will only elicit YOUR own personal data and not that of anybody else.

_IH8_UKCPM_

I was preparing for SAR to get copies of emails, call logs to customer services including recordings as their customer services had no idea there was any enforcement on our estate and no records of anything. I obviously have copies of emails and letters and have digitised everything already but I assume I can possibly get any internal emails or emails I was not party to if they contain my personal information.

I was wondering if it was good idea to submit one now and get everything so far, and also because I doubt their ability to comply with the timeline of responding around the holiday period which would land them in more hot water.

I work in IT industry so have good awareness of GDPR, SARs and FOIs etc.

Also I checked county planning portal last night as someone mentioned planning permission for the signs. I looked through the last 12 months of planning outcomes and see nothing for our estate whatsoever and the search function produced nothing for our address or any other roads on the estate. I note that the signs all seem to be mounted on existing light poles and one or two to walls so not sure if this avoids needing planning permission? I know very little of planning regs so if anyone has further advice on this please let me know.

I also note that one area of the estate has no enforcement signs whatsoever and cars continue to park there in breach of the rules and that a nearby plot appears to be a business and they continue to park a car out the front on shared land.

_IH8_UKCPM_

DW190 said:

I will say the management companies name is two words combined.

Word 1 is the position you came in if you win a gold medal

Word 2 is a type of wine produced in a country next to Spain

That would be First Port who appear to be quite large.

Property Management Services - FirstPort

Get all the residents to send them a SAR which should prove that no consultation ever took place.

Where do I send your prize 🤣

Fruitcake

Although not relevant in your case pole mounted ANPR scameras need planning permission unless the poles already exist.

With the exception of generic signs such as Open/Closed, Entrance/Exit, Doctor's Surgery, etcetera, all other signs greater than (I think) 0,3m2 require advertising consent. Parking company signs are classed as advertisements because they are advertising terms and conditions. 
As I said, not having said consent is a criminal offence. You should highlight this to the MA, pointing out that they are responsible for the actions of their agents, the PPC, and may be liable for criminal prosecution because they are jointly and severally liable.

In any case, you can now send photos of the signs at your location as part of a complaint to the local planning department, adding that residents (owners, landowners, freeholders/leaseholders, tenants) were never consulted and never agreed to any type of parking scheme.
Include in your complaints that this breaches your residential agreements (lease/AST/ownership,0 and the Landlord and Tenant Act 1987.
Get as many residents as possible to complain to the council, local councillors, everyone's MP.
All should ask that this matter should be brought up in parliament for debate as it will affect tens if not hundreds of thousands of people in the UK. Refer to Sir Greg Knight's Parking Bill and the DHLUC's inaction in getting the new mandatory parking code of conduct implemented.

_IH8_UKCPM_

Fruitcake said:

Although not relevant in your case pole mounted ANPR scameras need planning permission unless the poles already exist.

With the exception of generic signs such as Open/Closed, Entrance/Exit, Doctor's Surgery, etcetera, all other signs greater than (I think) 0,3m2 require advertising consent. Parking company signs are classed as advertisements because they are advertising terms and conditions. 
As I said, not having said consent is a criminal offence. You should highlight this to the MA, pointing out that they are responsible for the actions of their agents, the PPC, and may be liable for criminal prosecution because they are jointly and severally liable.

In any case, you can now send photos of the signs at your location as part of a complaint to the local planning department, adding that residents (owners, landowners, freeholders/leaseholders, tenants) were never consulted and never agreed to any type of parking scheme.
Include in your complaints that this breaches your residential agreements (lease/AST/ownership,0 and the Landlord and Tenant Act 1987.
Get as many residents as possible to complain to the council, local councillors, everyone's MP.
All should ask that this matter should be brought up in parliament for debate as it will affect tens if not hundreds of thousands of people in the UK. Refer to Sir Greg Knight's Parking Bill and the DHLUC's inaction in getting the new mandatory parking code of conduct implemented.

Thanks.

Yep no ANPR on site although there is CCTV across the estate and directly opposite our house so I could potentially ask any footage of myself as part of a SAR if I want to cause them more work.

The 0.3m² rule is what I have read too. Think the signs are roughly 30cm by 50cm so not sure that is over 0.3m².

I have been emailing back and forth giving the person I am speaking to prove they satisfied the relevant laws in introducing this scheme and they have not been able to prove so far so last email was to state the rules explicitly and advise that we fully expect UKCPM to take us to court and that MA is liable as well should that happen. It has now been raised as a formal complaint on my behalf personally (rather than jointly) so will follow that process (probably as a big a waste of time as the PPC appeals process) and will submit the formal complaint from residents jointly as well once I can get the signatures. Another neighbour on board today and their neighbour apparently has lots of issues with the MA as well.

Bit busy with work and recovering from COVID but trying my best to keep on it.

As always, thanks guys.

_IH8_UKCPM_

Oh and advised them of media involvement along with the fact that UKCPM and the MA have previously been investigated and exposed by the BBC in various programs.

Edit: sorry guys just found the edit button didn't see where it was hiding!