EV Discussion thread

1961Nick

Grumpy_chap said:

1961Nick said:

I'll be amazed if you don't get delivery before the June quarter end.

I was on cloud 9 yesterday when they called to confirm the collection for 9 am this Friday, 23rd.

A bit less happy when they called back to rearrange to 4 pm next Friday, 30th.  That is "by the skin of the teeth" June...

That's cruel.

Collection on the last day of the quarter is usually bedlam but at least you know there won't be any further delays.

silvercar

1961Nick said:

JKenH said:

I was just having a scan through the latest offerings from Tesla and came across this 0 miles M3P, supposedly at an £11k discount. 

https://tesla-info.com/car/GB-LRW3286_c7c1388391cca9b1c731c8de62761bd4

The warranty was activated on 15th March so it does look as if it's been a demonstrator. If so, it's likely to have done a few miles - although sometimes this can be reset back to zero to remove delivery miles.

I thought that was illegal?

Grumpy_chap

1961Nick said:

Collection on the last day of the quarter is usually bedlam but at least you know there won't be any further delays.

I just hope that achieving the 1/4 end is not by cutting corners with the PDI and vehicle prep.

The collection this Friday would have been super as we are off for a long weekend and could have taken the car.

Martyn1981 said:

I think I may be living vicariously through you, and getting quite excited. 

You're gonna love the TM3, but I suspect you'd be thrilled with any BEV, such a lovely driving experience, even for ex-petrolheads like me.

Yeah - I don't think I've been this excited about a new car (or even a new-to-me car) since I got my MG Metro.  That was, obviously, even better than the TM3 because it had red seat belts.  Unbeatable!

I did love driving the TM3 but, you are right I think that any EV would be fantastic.  To think, we were contemplating ordering an MG5 back in February time!
My older brother has an i3 and both him and his wife like that more than their SUV.

I'll be getting my TM3 earlier than my younger brother gets his BZ4X, which he ordered pretty much in the launch week way back (last August?) and was initially expected to be available in April - I think he is just waiting now until, well, whenever...  He paid more than me, too.  In fact, quite a lot more.

I still think the electronically controlled glove box on the TM3 is daft.
I suspect I'll spend most of the time in "chill" mode.  Do the same hypermiling techniques that I used in my petrol car work the same to maximise range / efficiency?

1961Nick

Grumpy_chap said:

1961Nick said:

Collection on the last day of the quarter is usually bedlam but at least you know there won't be any further delays.

I just hope that achieving the 1/4 end is not by cutting corners with the PDI and vehicle prep.

The collection this Friday would have been super as we are off for a long weekend and could have taken the car.

Martyn1981 said:

I think I may be living vicariously through you, and getting quite excited. 

You're gonna love the TM3, but I suspect you'd be thrilled with any BEV, such a lovely driving experience, even for ex-petrolheads like me.

Yeah - I don't think I've been this excited about a new car (or even a new-to-me car) since I got my MG Metro.  That was, obviously, even better than the TM3 because it had red seat belts.  Unbeatable!

I did love driving the TM3 but, you are right I think that any EV would be fantastic.  To think, we were contemplating ordering an MG5 back in February time!
My older brother has an i3 and both him and his wife like that more than their SUV.

I'll be getting my TM3 earlier than my younger brother gets his BZ4X, which he ordered pretty much in the launch week way back (last August?) and was initially expected to be available in April - I think he is just waiting now until, well, whenever...  He paid more than me, too.  In fact, quite a lot more.

I still think the electronically controlled glove box on the TM3 is daft.
I suspect I'll spend most of the time in "chill" mode.  Do the same hypermiling techniques that I used in my petrol car work the same to maximise range / efficiency?

Chill mode is really only of any use when someone inexperienced is driving the car. Drivers used to diesel engines instinctively stab the throttle to overcome turbo lag - do that in a Tesla & you'll go across the roundabout rather than round it!  Everything chill mode can do you can do yourself with sensible use of the accelerator pedal.

The l/h steering wheel button is now programmable (long push) & that may include opening the glovebox. 

If you want to hypermile - avoid drag racing, using the brakes & exceeding 60mph. That'll give you at least 4.5miles/kWh which is it's WLTP range.

Grumpy_chap

I'm feeling a little bit EV-smug this morning as I realise what a good deal I've got with the new car.

My wife mentioned that one of her friends is about to place an order for a Nissan Qashqai and mentioned that it is over £40k so they get hit with the >£500 yearly VED for 5 years.  I am not sure whether they are actually paying >£40k or got a discount to bring the bill below that, but the Qashqai starts from around £27k so I think if I was choosing one, I'd plump for a specification that avoided the VED uplift.

Anyway, they will be around the £40k purchase price, or a bit over, plus the £2.5k in tax over a few years so that will take them to a similar outlay as the TM3.  I said to my wife that she should suggest they go for a TM3/Y and they'd save a lot over time.

1961Nick

Grumpy_chap said:

I'm feeling a little bit EV-smug this morning as I realise what a good deal I've got with the new car.

My wife mentioned that one of her friends is about to place an order for a Nissan Qashqai and mentioned that it is over £40k so they get hit with the >£500 yearly VED for 5 years.  I am not sure whether they are actually paying >£40k or got a discount to bring the bill below that, but the Qashqai starts from around £27k so I think if I was choosing one, I'd plump for a specification that avoided the VED uplift.

Anyway, they will be around the £40k purchase price, or a bit over, plus the £2.5k in tax over a few years so that will take them to a similar outlay as the TM3.  I said to my wife that she should suggest they go for a TM3/Y and they'd save a lot over time.

The annual £0 VED annual renewal does make you smile.

The £0 routine servicing is also welcome as is the 2% BIK & 100% first year capital allowance.

JKenH

Grumpy_chap said:

I'm feeling a little bit EV-smug this morning as I realise what a good deal I've got with the new car.

My wife mentioned that one of her friends is about to place an order for a Nissan Qashqai and mentioned that it is over £40k so they get hit with the >£500 yearly VED for 5 years.  I am not sure whether they are actually paying >£40k or got a discount to bring the bill below that, but the Qashqai starts from around £27k so I think if I was choosing one, I'd plump for a specification that avoided the VED uplift.

Anyway, they will be around the £40k purchase price, or a bit over, plus the £2.5k in tax over a few years so that will take them to a similar outlay as the TM3.  I said to my wife that she should suggest they go for a TM3/Y and they'd save a lot over time.

I suppose different people have different priorities. Nissan’s business model must be working as it has been able to hike its prices for the Qashqai to above £40k and consistently keep it in the top 3 best selling cars in the UK in 2023. When Tesla launched the Model 3 at £42,990 in 2019, the most expensive Qashqai was £31,145.

JKenH

1961Nick said:

Grumpy_chap said:

I'm feeling a little bit EV-smug this morning as I realise what a good deal I've got with the new car.

My wife mentioned that one of her friends is about to place an order for a Nissan Qashqai and mentioned that it is over £40k so they get hit with the >£500 yearly VED for 5 years.  I am not sure whether they are actually paying >£40k or got a discount to bring the bill below that, but the Qashqai starts from around £27k so I think if I was choosing one, I'd plump for a specification that avoided the VED uplift.

Anyway, they will be around the £40k purchase price, or a bit over, plus the £2.5k in tax over a few years so that will take them to a similar outlay as the TM3.  I said to my wife that she should suggest they go for a TM3/Y and they'd save a lot over time.

The annual £0 VED annual renewal does make you smile.

The £0 routine servicing is also welcome as is the 2% BIK & 100% first year capital allowance.

But not for much longer. 😀 We have gone from two zero VED cars to two at the lowest rate (something like £155). I can live with that in the context of running a newish car. Most desirable EVs will be over the threshold when the new rate comes in in 2025. Will that impact on people’s choices? It would mine, but I’m not everyone.

The higher VED rate for £40k+ cars (currently ICE only), though,  for me is a real turn off. It is a visible deterrent in a way that servicing and maintenance costs aren’t. I am just too tight to shell out an extra £350 (or whatever the figure is) if I can get a similar age car that does the job avoiding the tax. 

We bought my wife’s car with a 5 year service plan costing £600 - one time hit (well for 5 years) that I factored into the purchase price. I’ve just had my Golf serviced at a VW dealership in Scunthorpe for £208 (including pollen filter). While the idea of no service cost is attractive, the idea of no annual service is less so, particularly if racking up the miles (which I don’t).   Things get picked up which might be safety critical - uneven tyre wear as an example. Perhaps Tesla’s business model works on the basis that if we don’t inspect the cars annually we don’t need to fix things we might spot during the warranty period. Perhaps I am being cynical there, but a lot of Tesla owners discover the front suspension problems when it’s too late, i.e. outside the warranty period. 

BIK and capital allowances don’t affect me nor any other private buyers (as opposed to company or lease drivers). For small businesses, self employed fleets, company cars and SalSac schemes it is a huge incentive to go EV but I am wondering if the sales flat lining we are seeing (in % terms) is due to that market now being saturated. The new rules were brought in wef 6 April 2020 and we are now 3 years on from that. Businesses and fleets with EV policies will no doubt renew with EVs but if a business was going to switch it probably would have done so by now. Similarly most looking to take advantage of the EV benefits of SalSac schemes will now already be on them. 

Martyn1981

Grumpy_chap said:

1961Nick said:

Collection on the last day of the quarter is usually bedlam but at least you know there won't be any further delays.

I just hope that achieving the 1/4 end is not by cutting corners with the PDI and vehicle prep.

The collection this Friday would have been super as we are off for a long weekend and could have taken the car.

Martyn1981 said:

I think I may be living vicariously through you, and getting quite excited. 

You're gonna love the TM3, but I suspect you'd be thrilled with any BEV, such a lovely driving experience, even for ex-petrolheads like me.

Yeah - I don't think I've been this excited about a new car (or even a new-to-me car) since I got my MG Metro.  That was, obviously, even better than the TM3 because it had red seat belts.  Unbeatable!

I did love driving the TM3 but, you are right I think that any EV would be fantastic.  To think, we were contemplating ordering an MG5 back in February time!
My older brother has an i3 and both him and his wife like that more than their SUV.

I'll be getting my TM3 earlier than my younger brother gets his BZ4X, which he ordered pretty much in the launch week way back (last August?) and was initially expected to be available in April - I think he is just waiting now until, well, whenever...  He paid more than me, too.  In fact, quite a lot more.

I still think the electronically controlled glove box on the TM3 is daft.
I suspect I'll spend most of the time in "chill" mode.  Do the same hypermiling techniques that I used in my petrol car work the same to maximise range / efficiency?

MG Metro, that takes me back, am I going mad or did they have a turbo indicator on the ceiling by the rear view mirror, that lit up? I almost got a Renault 5 turbo, but couldn't get insurance (too young), had to settle for the Trans-Am instead.

As Nick says, chill mode just backs off the power. But you'll be fine on range. I think the US EPA figures are much more accurate, and they suggest 333 miles is possible, which I think you'll get if you try hard enough, in good conditions. But our pre HP model would do 4m/kWh at 70mph even in 30C temps (but it took about 35 miles for the average to drop to that, after the initial cooling (couple of miles in was reading 600Wh/mile  ))

Is your brother sticking with the busyforks? Apparently they've unlocked the battery/charging a bit now, so you can get a couple of rapid charges in per 24hr, before it restricts. Actually it may be 3 charges of ~60% (20% to 80%) per 24hrs, can't remember.

I'm almost certainly over-thinking this, but perhaps be aware/careful at first when reversing, remember no gears, so you have ~300kW of power available. I didn't notice it, so maybe adjusted naturally, but a friend driving it, and reversing for the first time pointed out it was a bit 'nippy', and he's definitely a better driver than me.

Are you counting 'the sleeps to go' yet?

shinytop

I'm almost certainly over-thinking this, but perhaps be aware/careful at first when reversing, remember no gears, so you have ~300kW of power available. I didn't notice it, so maybe adjusted naturally, but a friend driving it, and reversing for the first time pointed out it was a bit 'nippy', and he's definitely a better driver than me.

Are you counting 'the sleeps to go' yet?

Is reverse restricted at all? Surely it won't let you go 100 mph in reverse?