Me vs my wife

ontheroad1970

sheramber said:

I am so used to my routine it’s killing me trying to constantly remember what days she will work the next week. I can’t plan myself out, let alone staff. 

That is the root of the problem. You don't want to change your routine.

It is not your wife's problem that you cannot remember when she will be working, so you cannot plan ahead.  

After 11 years your wife has found the need for change in her life. She is just as entitled  as you to do what she finds fulfilling in her life.

Marriage is meant to be a partnership not 'me versus my wife.'

Part of the problem is that retail now works on zero hours contracts so hours can change at short notice.  The knock on effect for a business owner is that they may end up duplicating cover and spending money that they needn't spend one week, and be short of cover another week according to the needs of the retail business.  This then forces the OP to hire people in a similar manner to retail which may not work in that sector.  £75k a year sounds a lot but in the SE?  Not that much, and as self employed need to factor in any risk of losing business.

I do think the OP needs to be more flexible, sas you don't get compromise by forcing a situation.  OP you need to be far less confrontational or you will end up with a far more expensive word starting with D.

TBagpuss

pinkshoes said:

I think some people are being a little harsh on the OP here and partaking in man-bashing!

I can see this from both sides.

The OP has a business and brings in the majority of the income. 

His wife wants a job and no longer wants to be a SAHM. Fair enough. 

The issue here is the job that the wife has chosen is not a good fit with the OPs business due to its sporadic hours. 

If the OP sold his business and took a job that fitted with his wife's hours then they couldn't afford the rent. 

I appreciate that the wife wants a job, but something has to give here. She needs to find a job that fits with the OPs job.

Is it possible for her to work full time and earn enough for the OP to then do a different job (give up the business) and do the majority of the childcare?

I don't think it's man bashing.

I have some sympathy for OP but its also notable that he does seem almost exclusively focused on his own wants and feelings, and not very open to possible solutions that involve anything other than his wife fitting around him!

OP, I think that, as several people have suggested, looking at some form of regular child care is probably part of the solution - so that there are at least a couple of days a week where there is wrap-around care so that you and you wife are not either of you trying to juggle work with the school run - if those days fall on days when your wife doesn't need to work, that could leave some space either for you and her to spend some less stressed time together, or for her to be able to do other things (whether having a bit of 'me' time, or doing things around the house, or a mix of both.

If you have a quieter period at work then you could also use that time to do something else. 

I'd also suggest that the two of you sit down and have a conversation that isn't you demanding that she make changes or ask for different hours, but which is more a discussion about what is needed to ensure that the kids are cared for - the suggestion of a set chart or timetable is a good one

If you had wrap around care on (say) Mondays and Fridays, you could agree  that she was responsible for the children before ad after school/ nursery on Tuesdays and Thursdays, that you were responsible on Wednesdays and Saturdays, and that you would both be at home and caring for the children on a Sunday,  and that if either of you needed to change those dates it's on you to agree a variation - so if she is scheduled to work on the Thursday she would need to either agree with you that you'd swap the Thursday and Friday, or speak to the childminder or to a friend to see if she can arrange alternative care, or try to swap her shift at work with a co-worker. And similarly, if she is scheduled for a Sunday , that she's talk to you about whether you have a family day on the Saturday instead. Equally, if you had to work on a Wednesday or Saturday it would be your responsibility to sort out alternative care, whether that meant swapping a day with her, or making arrangements with a third party, or delegating the work to another member of your staff . 

I do think that you would both benefit from talking to Relate, as it sounds as though part of the issue her is that the two of you are not listening to each other or communicating effectively - it sounds as bit as though part of the problem is that you felt stressed and resentful as you feel that she is not doing her fair share and is expecting you to manage all of the driving, bills , organization etc. I suspect that she may feel that you are in the habit of telling her what to do rather than asking or trying to agree, and it may well be that sh is pushing back by refusing to 'give in' when you tell her to do things. 
I think if you were both willing to listen properly to each other, and were both willing to try to compromise a but to meet in the middle, you might each be happier and find that some of the current problems become a lot easier to solve. Something like relate can give you the help and support to learn to have more more  constructive conversations and to improve your communication skills. (and if she won't go, consider going by yourself, as this can help identify issues and possible ways you can change your approach / communication style to see whether those things are helpful.

It sounds as though both of you re currently stressed and feel resentful of each other, and that's not ideal for anyone. You can't change her behaviour, but you can start to change your own behaviour and the way you approach her, and you may find that that's enough to open the door to better communication. 

Lavendyr

crispy99 said:

the4tails said:

Astounded by what I have just read. The audacity. The misogyny. You have zero respect for your wife and what she has done for you and your family. She deserves better. 

Triggered much? What planet are you on. I’m a real man going out doing real work, earning a real living for my family. I do my share of housework and get on fine looking after the kids. This thread was about how to handle her working ever changing days and hours while trying to run a very busy and stressful business. 

Jog on

What is a "real man" exactly? What is "real work"? Your wife is tryig to do "real work" too. In fact, disregard that. She's been doing "real work" bringing up your children. Believe me, that is WORK. 

If you want to figure out how to handle your "busy and stressful business" while handlimg "her working ever changing days" then the best possible thing you can BOTH do is sit down and talk and work it out as equals. 

Throwing words around like "triggered" isn't helpful. And we can't help you and your wife run your joint household (of which she is an equal part).  

Throughout this thread I've seen little that suggests you think respectfully of your wife - who has, from your account, spent a fair few years at home bringing up your children. And if she wants to return to work, I suggest you find a way to support her and make it work for you, her and your family, rather than disparaging her attempts. 

Lavendyr

crispy99 said:

It’s a shame that clearly most people here think I’m being insensitive & controlling but you have to understand my wife has never wanted to work until now, does not want to deal with any bills, any problems, debt or any planning for the future. 

She has a driving license but can’t drive, a phone but literally can’t talk on it. So when I say I HAVE to deal with everything I actually have to. I thought this job would be great tackling some of the issues like her confidence and help meet new people. so went along with it just honestly didn’t expect it to get out of hand. 

Is this really the case? Or is she so uncomfortable with your behaviour that she doesn't dare?

Step back and take a good look at yourself. You make your wife sound as though she is incapable of living her own life. If she's managed to secure a job then that clearly isn't the case. I think your wife is far more capable than you give her credit for and you should be supportive of her - or at the very least, you should be talking to her about a way to make her needs work with yours and your childrens'. 

-------------

Additional info pertinent to the thread. For others ref: https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/6237574/what-s-my-best-employment-option-for-a-mortgage#latest 

"I am a company Director of an events company on PAYE currently earning £12500, The company does have good profits and I’ve spoke to my accountant about taking dividends to obtain a mortgage but these self employed mortgages will take an average of 2/3 years, it’s just working out too much in tax! 

So here’s my other option... I own half another LTD company but not on paper, not even on PAYE, the company turns over about 250k and profit of around 100k. Would it be possible to be put on PAYE for 80k a year, company deducts my tax from wages and pays into my personal account for around 3 months and then apply for a mortgage? 

I know this may be frowned upon but it’s all about saving money right? "

I don't understand how you can't own half of a company "not on paper". Either you own shares or you don't. 

ComicGeek

As a man, a business owner and a father, I'm absolutely staggered by this thread - feels like something from the distant past not a modern relationship.

Firstly your wife has been critical in supporting your (not her's) dream of creating a business for many years - you admit that you can't do it without her help, even though you belittle the help she has provided. 

Secondly you should be encouraging her to do a role outside of family life that fulfills her regardless of income - it just comes across that you want a robot at home to work around you, not an actual human being with their own needs and dreams. 5 kids under 10? She deserves a medal, not your contempt! 

Thirdly you work Thursday to Sunday, and have Monday to Wednesday off? So you don't actually see your 5 kids at the weekend much then, and that all falls on her again - then you have 3 nice days off while the kids are at school and wonder what all the fuss is about...  

Spendless

ComicGeek said:

Thirdly you work Thursday to Sunday, and have Monday to Wednesday off? So you don't actually see your 5 kids at the weekend much then, and that all falls on her again - then you have 3 nice days off while the kids are at school and wonder what all the fuss is about...  

I never spotted these working days. Those days are the busiest in retail and the weekends hardest to find official childcare for.


My teenage daughter would have absolutely adored a weekend babysitting job whilst at sixth form college. Ask around. With your other days off you're only looking at finding cover for Thurs & Fri. 

Retireinten

As a working mum of thankfully, just two children, who's often had to juggle a high pressured job with being the primary child carer, I think the OP is getting a bit of an ear bashing to be honest. 

How many people on this thread are being expected to earn £75k a year whilst taking responsibility for four children on what is supposed to be their work days?  

The general consensus on this thread is the husband isn't being supportive of the wife but I don't see the wife valuing the OPs contribution to the household either. Where is the compromise on her either side in all this? 

OP runs a business - he needs to be honest with himself about his level of flexibility with his days/hours to accommodate the wife's work more. His wife now works, he can't expect her to work and for nothing to change in the home - wife is no longer a full time SAHM, so he needs to do his share. 

Similarly the wife can't expect husband to constantly chop and change his working week to manage her ever changing hours unless she's prepared for the financial repercussions.  It is not reasonable to expect the husband to look after four children when he is supposed to be at work.  

OP, you must talk to your wife about this. Work out what you can do at the weekends so she can offer to fix her basic hours, including some hours over the weekend/busy periods.  Also work out between you what days/hours she can work extra where you're available without it affecting your business too much. 

Consider if childcare is an option and how much it would cost too. Arranging childcare on the days you are both at work is a joint responsibility to resolve, not just yours or hers.  She shouldn't just be assuming you can look after the kids when she picks up an extra shift... but this works both ways! 

If neither of you can compromise then you have two options. Struggle on earning that £75k whilst juggling the childcare whenever your wife works. Eventually the kids will be old enough to look after themselves and hopefully the resentment won't result in divorce. Or step back from the business to accommodate your increased responsibilities at home and financially downsize you lives to suit. I'm sure your wife won't mind the seven of you downsizing to a small 3 bed flat. She can always increase her hours to full time, maybe move into a higher paying  managerial role to help replace the lost earnings from the business if it is an issue for her... and hopefully the resentment on either side won't result in divorce. 

In other words, neither of you have an option but to sit down and agree a compromise that works for you both. 

Lavendyr

I think we agree, @Retireinten, in that the husband and wife need to talk to one another and compromise. 

We are also only hearing the husband's side. So I don't think we can judge accurately whether the wife is being supportive or not. 

diystarter7

ComicGeek said:

As a man, a business owner and a father, I'm absolutely staggered by this thread - feels like something from the distant past not a modern relationship.

Firstly your wife has been critical in supporting your (not her's) dream of creating a business for many years - you admit that you can't do it without her help, even though you belittle the help she has provided. 

Secondly you should be encouraging her to do a role outside of family life that fulfills her regardless of income - it just comes across that you want a robot at home to work around you, not an actual human being with their own needs and dreams. 5 kids under 10? She deserves a medal, not your contempt! 

Thirdly you work Thursday to Sunday, and have Monday to Wednesday off? So you don't actually see your 5 kids at the weekend much then, and that all falls on her again - then you have 3 nice days off while the kids are at school and wonder what all the fuss is about...  

Nothing staggering at all.
OP is seeking unbiased advice rather than washing his laundry with friends and family who often bite back sooner or later.

OP was clear it was a joint decision as his wife was happy to stay at home and bring up the kids.

OP has a point re income and as we all only know too well, we need even more money than before just to run a home
and it's only going to get worse.

The wife could even work as a volunteer if they could afford this but they can and the point of the OP as I see it is, that he wanted her to be happier but the wife forgot the side of income that is funding the family's lifestyle.

About retail work, it can be rewarding if you are that kind of person and like meeting people making new friends, go out after work, parties.etc but what the OP stated re working days, I agree with the OP as the shift pattern/rotta is not really there for people/couples that have to manage a child never mind 5.

My wife loved her job at the local supermarket, it was local and just walked there and back 5 mins and i picked her up if it was late but then the shift/rota pattern was so unpredictable that we rarely got the weekend together and we both agreed she'd leave.
(TBH and not relating to the OP, I did get a bit jealous when she talked about a couple of guys and in particular one of them all of the time but having said that my wife had the same problem when I went out at work who were mainly women)

I can relate to the OP#'s post other than the business bit as I've never worked for myself but it is hard as we all know and all could be easily lost.

diystarter7

Lavendyr said:

I think we agree, @Retireinten, in that the husband and wife need to talk to one another and compromise. 

We are also only hearing the husband's side. So I don't think we can judge accurately whether the wife is being supportive or not. 

Lavendyr said:

I think we agree, @Retireinten, in that the husband and wife need to talk to one another and compromise. 

We are also only hearing the husband's side. So I don't think we can judge accurately whether the wife is being supportive or not. 

The husband has posted and I agree they need to talk to each other.  I for one don't need to hear the other side and this could have easily been the wife posting and the same stance would have applied.