Energy news in general

victor2

MacPingu1986 said:

Troytempest said:

Interesting debate but I come back to my original point - EV's and heat pumps will not gain mass adoption until cost, infrastructure and price line up.

Having a heat pump would be physically impossible for some dwellings and many could not charge a car at home....

Which they're all on a solid trajectory to do.

On EV charging at home, whilst its definitely a nice advantage if you have it, the average car travels less than 100 miles per week so even without home charging the typical owner would only need to charge every fortnight (with ranges increasing all the time), and this could be done at work if you have charge-points, or at the supermarket, or in town running/errands/drinking a coffee - all that stuff.

(and for perspective, no ICE owner can fuel up at home)

And for perspective, no EV owner can fuel up on their way to their destination in a matter of a few minutes.

Troytempest

MacPingu1986 said:

Troytempest said:

Interesting debate but I come back to my original point - EV's and heat pumps will not gain mass adoption until cost, infrastructure and price line up.

Having a heat pump would be physically impossible for some dwellings and many could not charge a car at home....

Which they're all on a solid trajectory to do.

On EV charging at home, whilst its definitely a nice advantage if you have it, the average car travels less than 100 miles per week so even without home charging the typical owner would only need to charge every fortnight (with ranges increasing all the time), and this could be done at work if you have charge-points, or at the supermarket, or in town running/errands/drinking a coffee - all that stuff.

(and for perspective, no ICE owner can fuel up at home)

You are correct - NO ICE cars can be fuelled at home. But lets not be silly here. I can fill up with fuel at numerous places within a few minutes drive - takes about 3 minutes with no stress!

the_lunatic_is_in_my_head

mmmmikey said:

Good forestry practice is to fell and re-stock

Article is referring to primary forests, which are "old growth" forests not significantly disturbed by human activity, I don't think they need our "management" . 

matt_drummer

the_lunatic_is_in_my_head said:

mmmmikey said:

Good forestry practice is to fell and re-stock

Article is referring to primary forests, which are "old growth" forests not significantly disturbed by human activity, I don't think they need our "management" . 

Ever thought of disease, or pests?

There are all sorts of reasons why some trees need felling.

mmmmikey

I can't help thinking that as things stand EVs are a perfectly sensible, cost-effective option for some and a non-starter for others. Where you live, how many miles you drive and where to make a big difference to the practicality. And depending on your budget you're currently limited on the second hand market. Then there are issues around towing ability which can be irrelevant for some and critical for others. They're still a way off being a realistic option for me but IMHO EV's are one of the great success stories of the 20th century. 

If my budget would cover an EV up to the job of towing a trailer full of logs or a small caravan I wouldn't hesitate as long as it had a reliable range of a couple of hundred miles while towing and I could get it serviced at the local garage. I'd be very happy to be proved wrong but as far as I can see we're not there yet.

MacPingu1986

Troytempest said:

MacPingu1986 said:

Troytempest said:

Interesting debate but I come back to my original point - EV's and heat pumps will not gain mass adoption until cost, infrastructure and price line up.

Having a heat pump would be physically impossible for some dwellings and many could not charge a car at home....

Which they're all on a solid trajectory to do.

On EV charging at home, whilst its definitely a nice advantage if you have it, the average car travels less than 100 miles per week so even without home charging the typical owner would only need to charge every fortnight (with ranges increasing all the time), and this could be done at work if you have charge-points, or at the supermarket, or in town running/errands/drinking a coffee - all that stuff.

(and for perspective, no ICE owner can fuel up at home)

You are correct - NO ICE cars can be fuelled at home. But lets not be silly here. I can fill up with fuel at numerous places within a few minutes drive - takes about 3 minutes with no stress!

My point is that lack of home charging is portrayed as a killer argument against EVs out of all proportion to it's actual effect on a person with average car use - ie: only needing to charge up every 2-3 weeks and you combine the charging with supermarket shopping/parked at work/errands etc... so the charging in practice takes "zero time".

Scot_39

Troytempest said:

MacPingu1986 said:

Troytempest said:

Interesting debate but I come back to my original point - EV's and heat pumps will not gain mass adoption until cost, infrastructure and price line up.

Having a heat pump would be physically impossible for some dwellings and many could not charge a car at home....

Which they're all on a solid trajectory to do.

On EV charging at home, whilst its definitely a nice advantage if you have it, the average car travels less than 100 miles per week so even without home charging the typical owner would only need to charge every fortnight (with ranges increasing all the time), and this could be done at work if you have charge-points, or at the supermarket, or in town running/errands/drinking a coffee - all that stuff.

(and for perspective, no ICE owner can fuel up at home)

You are correct - NO ICE cars can be fuelled at home. But lets not be silly here. I can fill up with fuel at numerous places within a few minutes drive - takes about 3 minutes with no stress!

Anyone with an ice car can top up with 5l - just over 1 uk gallon from a plastic fuel container anywhere they can stop or have stopped if run out  including at home. I don't carry one, my father always did.  

That would get me c50m

Or say 20l, 4.5 gallons from a modern equivelent of old style jerry can style where permitted - which my uncle still carries in his more rural location every winter in tge back of his old land-rover.

That would get me 200m - further than many smaller  BEV - especially in winter.


Although many insurers might get iffy if have say more than a certain volume stored domestically even in a detached garage.

michaels

You would still need to visit a petrol station to fill up all those jerrycans.

My Leaf cost 12.3k new almost 10 years ago, it has done 90k miles and retains 80% of original range which is still fine for us.  The majority of charging has been below 10p per unit (sometimes much below) for about 3.5-4 miles per kwh.

No road tax, about 12 tyres (£600) and a few suspension bits - say £300 total.  Probably 2 wiper blades as well.

Can't see that an ice car from new would have been cheaper or more convenient.

Gerry1

michaels said:

The majority of charging has been below 10p per unit (sometimes much below) for about 2.5-4 miles per 4kwh.

Did you mean 'about 2.5-4 miles per kWh'?

Gerry1

michaels said:
No road tax

That won't be the case for new EVs, and there are horrendous VED surcharges for five years if the list price (including options) exceeds £40k.  This tax raid already includes most EVs.  The limit hasn't been raised since its introduction in 2018, so it won't be long before it applies to all EVs.