PfP Energy ceases trading - here's everything you need to know

devondiver

devondiver said:

bagand96 said:

devondiver said:

bagand96 said:

fly-catchers said:

Though somebody is earning the interest on the £340 credit I had/have with PFP.

Again, nobody is earning interest on your credit balance.  In the energy sector consumer funds are not ringfenced, money you paid to PFP just went into their accounts, and given that they are insolvent, there isn't any money!

At some point someone (BG, presumably) is going to have to pay out the credit balances. Up to the point this money is paid out it is in existence (albeit in the digital ether of accounting) and it is being utilised - by BG if it is they who are about to fork it out. Every day they contrive to delay payment they still have the use of this money. How can this not be referred to as interest?

So - my question is still: what rules etc. are in place to encourage BG (or whoever) to perform this function in a timely fashion?

- PFP (under the control of the administrators) have to issue Final Bills

- PFP then advise BG of account credit balances 
- BG then apply the credit amount to those accounts 

British Gas are not contriving to delay payment. They have absolutely no control of how quickly PFP produce the Final Bills. 

PFP are now controlled by the administrators. Part of the administrators duty is to minimise the costs of the administration process. As such PFP will now be run on a skeleton staff.

There are no rules on how quickly a defunct provider has to provide a final bill, how quickly that information must be passed to the SoLR, or how quickly the SoLR must apply credit to accounts. 

- the yet-to-be-returned credit balances amount to substantial interest-free credit - which is not without cost to those unwillingly providing it.

Regarding timing of 'final bills' - I know that my (accurate) PFP final bill was available prior to 8th November, and this may well apply to most, or even all, PFP (and other) customers. So talk of final bills and balances not being available until after New Year are concerning to say the least.

FWIW: - As above, I tried to raise this point a while back but there didn't seem to be much interest (pun intended  )

Perhaps it's past time to rattle someone's bars over this.

house_help

I had my first BG bill today. Electric only showing opening balance of £0 from 7 October.

There is additional line under "Adjustments before VAT" for "Supplier of Last Resort transfer period Standing Charge for 27 days". This looks to be for period 10 Sep to 6 October? (I thought it should be from the 11th?)

Awaiting still the final bill from PFP which guess will be up to 10 / 11th September and then BG to bill for missing period to 6th October?

devondiver

My 'Final Bill' from PFP, which was briefly available on their website portal on or about 8th November, was in two parts - one from 27th Aug to 27th Sep (my usual billing date) and a second from 27th to 30th Sep (the start date on which, I believe, my BG account was officially set up). The figures were based on my supplied meter readings and their charges were spot on - at PFP rates (including Standing Charge at non-DD tariff rates, since I had cancelled early).

I guess the administrators and/or BG then stepped in to rescind these bills with the intention of billing the period from 10 Sep-on at BG rates. Hence it's all a bit of mess now and we're all left in limbo while they re-do the arithmetic and try to smooth-out the changeover. I suppose the raising of bills for SCs is a start - but mine (on the BG portal) says it's "based on estimated readings for the period 30th Sep to 1st Nov", but with no further detail (not even a mention of Standing Charge), which is non-sensical.
 
Our outstanding PFP credit balances are, of course, in the meantime inert (for us) but being utilised by whoever's account in which the money (which does exist) is currently residing.

piano

I'm very disappointed in the lack of progress. So far I have received one bill from British Gas (an underestimate of my electricity usage even though I supplied meter readings to them, but no charge for gas). Then I got another small non-invoiced charge with no explanation. I have smart meters installed by British Gas when I was previously with them, but BG is only taking readings from the gas meter, and doesn't give me the option of submitting meter readings when I want. 

No bill yet from PFP because of its byzantine structure. PFP Energy overcharged me £200+ which is still parked with them - will that be considered an asset of PFPE or PFPES by the Administrators, rather than treated as what it is, *my* money? I understand I will eventually get a refund of PFP credit from British Gas, but am I correct in thinking that won't be based on credits transferred from PFP but financed through a refund scheme that I will later have to pay for myself because of a levy that will be added to future bills for every UK energy user?

bagand96

piano said:

 I understand I will eventually get a refund of PFP credit from British Gas, but am I correct in thinking that won't be based on credits transferred from PFP but financed through a refund scheme that I will later have to pay for myself because of a levy that will be added to future bills for every UK energy user?

It's extremely unlikely that any credits will be passed from PFP to British Gas.  PFP is in administration = there is no money.  Whilst it technically doesn't mean there is £0 in PFP's accounts, they are insolvent so it means that they owe more money than they have. The administrators wind up the business and work out which creditors to pay, but generally its pennies in the £ if anything at all.

You are right in your understanding of the industry levy and how Ofgem protects customer credit balances.  British Gas will come to an arrangement with Ofgem on what they can claim to cover the costs of PFP SoLR.  Ofgem then pass this cost onto the industry (i.e. all other suppliers) which of course means the consumers will pay eventually.

devondiver

bagand96 said:

You are right in your understanding of the industry levy and how Ofgem protects customer credit balances.  British Gas will come to an arrangement with Ofgem on what they can claim to cover the costs of PFP SoLR.  Ofgem then pass this cost onto the industry (i.e. all other suppliers) which of course means the consumers will pay eventually.

So the over-riding question remains:

What pressures currently exist to motivate Administrators/British Gas/Ofgem/Whoever to assign customer credit balances sooner rather than later?

 - And if the answer is, at it appears to be, 'little or none' then what pressures can be brought to bear which might improve this situation, when and by whom?

The fact remains that the longer that 'they' can continue to withhold repayments the longer 'they' benefit from holding 'the funds' (which do exist) and the greater the cost to 'us'.

QrizB

devondiver said:

... 'the funds' (which do exist) ...

Evidence, please, that the funds do exist?

agentcain

QrizB said:

devondiver said:

... 'the funds' (which do exist) ...

Evidence, please, that the funds do exist?

Bank transfer statements minus energy bills.
If the net result is positive, they exist unless someone consumed them unlawfully.

QrizB

agentcain said:

QrizB said:

devondiver said:

... 'the funds' (which do exist) ...

Evidence, please, that the funds do exist?

Bank transfer statements minus energy bills.
If the net result is positive, they exist unless someone consumed them unlawfully.

So you have no evidence? That's fine.

lisyloo

agentcain said:

QrizB said:

devondiver said:

... 'the funds' (which do exist) ...

Evidence, please, that the funds do exist?

Bank transfer statements minus energy bills.
If the net result is positive, they exist unless someone consumed them unlawfully.

You don’t really understand how businesses and cash flow works do you.
you don’t have an individual physical piggy bank at the supplier.
cash flow means your money would have been (lawfully) used to pay other bills.
this is a perfectly lawful process called business cash flow.