Legacy benefits

calcotti

Gig1968 said:..if those on ESA wish to transfer to Universal Credit and gain the extra £20 uplift they are quite welcome too), does that not just prove the point that people on old style ESA should be entitled to a £20 uplift...

Rather, doesn't it prove they are not being discriminated against because they could have accessed the uplift if they wanted to.

Gig1968 said:..How can people keep saying that the uplift for universal credit was for people who were badly affected by covid financially, 

I think it was only suggested by the government atet it was aimed at people in work, or recently in work.

Gig1968

I strongly disagree. It is not up to claimants to change benefits so they can access a £20 uplift. 
The government should simply treat everyone in a fair way during the pandemic.

The minister said on many occasions claimants are able to apply for universal credit if they wish to, dangling a carrot.
I'm afraid I just don't see the judge buying this scenario.
The lawyers of the two ESA claimants will hopefully get us all a result.

The comments of financial hardship in universal credit I understand,  but there are some 275000 ESA claimants who have been migrated to universal credit (mandatory by the government) so if the hardship only applies to workers or recently in work as per your comment above should they return their twenty pounds.

Bet the government wouldn't wanted to move the remaining 1.75 million people to universal credit in such a hurry. 

It may not matter because from what I understand if the government is found to have acted unlawfully then the £20 uplift will be backdated to when the first payment was made.

Lanzarote1938

Would be interesting for someone on legacy benefits to say just how their costs rose by £20 a week during the pandemic. Or is just a case of 'they got it so why shouldn't I?'

poppy12345

Lanzarote1938 said:

Would be interesting for someone on legacy benefits to say just how their costs rose by £20 a week during the pandemic. Or is just a case of 'they got it so why shouldn't I?'

I'm a legacy benefit claimer and i've said right from the first lockdown that my expenses didn't increase at all. Actually, quite the opposite, i saved money because shops weren't open and all i could do was food shopping. Now i know that internet shopping never closed but i prefer to go out to do my shopping because always like to "see" what i buy before deciding. With the money i saved i treated myself to some new living room furniture.

Did my bills increase? Nope because i'm home most of the time anyway, so during winter months my gas and electric stayed the same as always.

Would i complain if i got the extra? Of course not but i'm not going to complain because i didn't get it because there's so many people that struggled to even put food on the table.

Gig1968

Same could be said for all those 275000 former ESA claimants that were moved by the government into Universal credit and were awarded the £20 uplift. As I remember it the pandemic affected everyone. So if your on universal credit and not working according to you, you should not be entitled to the rise.
Why should legacy benefit people have to justify what Extra costs they have.
Did you spend day after day queuing at supermarkets to get shopping for your mom and dad and brining it back in taxis

Then take it five miles in at a taxi each week.
I have nevr yet had a taxi driver say to me on you are a legacy benefit man I will give you a free fare.  That's where my costs went.
Folks in their eighties look to their kids to look after them.  No pandemic bus pass used.
People who are on ESA are often overlooked by many in this country and are poorly treated, most of us, did not chose not to be able to work or chose our current situations. I worked for twenty five years before being struck down with severe epilepsy. Life has been harsh with me. I really hope  the government loses because the chancellor and that minister has shirked his responsibility towards the disabled and sick  and getting around without being able to use public transport.

Spoonie_Turtle

Gig1968 said:

Same could be said for all those 275000 former ESA claimants that were moved by the government into Universal credit and were awarded the £20 uplift. 

I keep seeing you say this but have not heard of it.  Who and when?

kaMelo

Gig1968 said:

Same could be said for all those 275000 former ESA claimants that were moved by the government into Universal credit and were awarded the £20 uplift. As I remember it the pandemic affected everyone. So if your on universal credit and not working according to you, you should not be entitled to the rise.
Why should legacy benefit people have to justify what Extra costs they have.
Did you spend day after day queuing at supermarkets to get shopping for your mom and dad and brining it back in taxis

Then take it five miles in at a taxi each week.
I have nevr yet had a taxi driver say to me on you are a legacy benefit man I will give you a free fare.  That's where my costs went.
Folks in their eighties look to their kids to look after them.  No pandemic bus pass used.
People who are on ESA are often overlooked by many in this country and are poorly treated, most of us, did not chose not to be able to work or chose our current situations. I worked for twenty five years before being struck down with severe epilepsy. Life has been harsh with me. I really hope  the government loses because the chancellor and that minister has shirked his responsibility towards the disabled and sick  and getting around without being able to use public transport.

I think you keep missing the point that others have legitimately raised, in life sometimes you have a choice to make.
Anyone in receipt of a legacy benefit has the choice to either remain on that legacy benefit or claim Universal Credit instead. Before doing so they can work out which option would be better for their circumstances and choose that option. Those already on Universal Credit don't have a choice.
How is that policy in any way shape or form unfair to those on legacy benefits?  

A court will of course decide but the whole case seems to be based upon, "they got it, I want it too" which fails to grasp the fact that there is nothing actually preventing them from having it.
Who knows, It may even be decided unfair that those on legacy benefits have a choice, to correct that unfairness migration to UC becomes accelerated.

As the old saying goes, be careful what you wish for, it may just come true

Gig1968

The details are on the government statistics for DWP .
The first trial of managed migration took place in Harrogate.
The government moved those people to universal credit.
It's not the point of having to move to get the uplift.
It's the decision not to uplift it.
There are 2.4 million people on ESA, can't wait to see Mrs coffee face when the courts decide they have been unlawful

Twenty pounds times many months equals fairness to the sick and disabled and pain in the pocket to the chancellor well deserved

calcotti

Gig1968 said:

Same could be said for all those 275000 former ESA claimants that were moved by the government into Universal credit 

Gig1968 said:

The details are on the government statistics for DWP .
The first trial of managed migration took place in Harrogate.

I think you are misreading something here. There is no way that the Harrogate trial involved the moving of 275,000 former ESA claimants. The trial itself was capped at a maximum of 10,000 claimants and then COVID intervened and the trial was suspended.
https://revenuebenefits.org.uk/universal-credit/guidance/existing-tax-credit-claimants/managed-migration 

The pilot project began in July 2019.
In January 2020 the government reported that about 80 people had been engaged with and of these around 13 (for the avoidance of doubt - thirteen) people had been moved from legacy benefits to UC during the intervening six month period. The pilot was completely suspended in March 2020.

Spoonie_Turtle

Gig1968 said:

The details are on the government statistics for DWP .

Please provide a link?  I find it very difficult to navigate and to find the pages I'm looking for in areas of the government site with which I'm unfamiliar (well, I also find it difficult when they change areas with which I was previously familiar!)