Possible dispute over jointly inherited house

DepositSaver

xylophone said:

I'm not in any rush nor desperate for the money, and am more than happy to give him time. He's the one who has said he wants things sorted out and been complaining things aren't moving fast enough. The one thing I really don't want is to own half a house which I could end up having to pay to maintain, and which could have CGT implications for me in future. I am open to any other solution. I hope I am showing him kindness, but it is sometimes not easy when he isn't always kind himself (now and in the past).

It is a difficult situation.

It appears that the house is not in good repair and that owning it could prove quite a burden.

Why not put it to your brother that from that point of view alone, selling the property and buying one more suitable for his needs could be the optimal solution?

Suppose the house fetched £350,000  (so that your share would be £175,000) but he would need £300,000 to buy the new property outright.

You could offer him an interest free loan of the £125,000 against a first charge on the new property?

If the house were worth anywhere near £350,000 I wouldn't be worrying about this anywhere near as much - £175,000 would buy my brother somewhere lovely and leave him with a fair chunk of cash to furnish it and then to keep as savings. Sadly, half the value of the house isn't enough to buy somewhere lovely hence one of my suggestions to him of selling and him having more of the proceeds. I'm not sure what a first charge on the new property means? 

DepositSaver

I have come across something earlier today which suggests that while the house is still owned by the estate, the estate is responsible for any utility bills, and the cost of these gets paid back from the estate once probate is granted. Does this still apply is someone is living in the house or is it only applicable when the property is empty? My brother put all the bills into his name and is paying them, which seems correct to me because he is living there and using gas and electricity, but I was confused by what I read earlier?

xylophone

 I'm not sure what a first charge on the new property means? 

Do you have a mortgage loan?
If so, your mortgagee (lender) has a "first charge" on your property - that is to say, if it were sold, your mortgagee has the right to repayment of the loan before any of the proceeds are paid to you.
This charge will have been recorded at the Land Registry.

Savvy_Sue

DepositSaver said:

He is 43. I don't know what age he would need to be to get an equity release mortgage? 
I will certainly be making it clear that he wouldn't be homeless now that I know the sale and purchase can happen as part of a normal chain. I had stupidly not thought about the deposit. Would exchange and completion on the same day get round that? I've not been in a chain before as I was a FTB buying a chain free place, and I ca week before completion so not sure how exchange and completion on the same day works.  

Exchange and completion on the same day wouldn't necessarily get round the lack of a deposit, and it's nerve-wracking. You'd either be doing EandC on two properties on the same day (doubly nerve-wracking), or having an overlap. If anything goes wrong, you're back at square one. 

xylophone

while the house is still owned by the estate, the estate is responsible for any utility bills, and the cost of these gets paid back from the estate once probate is granted. 

See https://www.co-oplegalservices.co.uk/media-centre/articles-jan-apr-2017/settling-utility-bills-after-the-death-of-a-loved-one/#:~:text=If you lived with the,name, but that's about it.

Rodders53

Usually the deposit money from the purchaser of <your current property> gets passed up the chain to become the deposit on the <one you are buying>.  
The money resides within the Conveyancing Solicitors Client Accounts and is just a promise from one Solicitor to another, to another... to pay up if ever needed.
So often no need for deposit monies at all when you are in the middle of a chain (unless one seller in the chain won't agree to the ever-smaller %age of selling price as the "deposit money" goes up the chain).

I've only had to lodge a deposit on our first house (1980) and had to top up the 5% going up the chain for this house (by £1k) as the purchaser of our last house couldn't come up with / calculate the 10% correctly (at the very last moment before exchange), four years ago.

davilown

DepositSaver said:

At the moment I am feeling that if he is insistent that he wants to live in the house and won't even consider selling (and I appreciate it would be hard to sell while he still lives there) then he needs to own it 100%.  I'll try to talk to him about whether he really can afford the upkeep of somewhere not in great condition while unemployed and suggest that a newer smaller place might be easier and cheaper to run, but I don' know if he will listen.

It needs to be a clean break - better to get a solicitor involved early to organise.  They would have had experience and able to provide the most up-to-date guidance.

This isn't his choice - the executors have to carry out the will as it dictates unless you have a DoV. He would need to be evicted first, but I think this would be forceable eviction so he would then be entitled to claim council housing help however he would then have a potentially large sum of money that would prevent him from receiving any benefits once the house is sold.  There is some leeway if that money goes towards buying somewhere else to live but I'm not on the timelines.

If you were to give him a private mortgage, how would he pay it?  He won't be entitled to any housing benefit so would only be living off his JSA (or what ever it is now).

Fire_Fox

Weighing in from the perspective of 'homeowner on state benefits, with chronic health issues and a healthcare background' AKA Captain Hindsight/ Captain Obvious. You sound like a great sibling; please understand that I mean to be of help *not* taking sides, not hinting at, nor implying anything. I hope *you* have the support you need in these challenging times and sad circumstances.

Poorly maintained homes or contents go downhill within a year or three, become a millstone and become overwhelming. The favoured option to support those on low incomes is equity release, or a grant where there is little equity. *One off* system and what needs doing is determined by the council. It isn't how you would maintain and renovate your own home *at all*. Point being, being ultra generous now likely isn't the solution (which you know, I think).

Be aware that, for many purposes, a mental health diagnosis will denote your brother as 'vulnerable'. That could be determined by an organisation (eg. solicitor, council) or the person themselves or their representative/ support bubble/ person involved in their care. That can be to the advantage or the detriment of you all depending when it is flagged up.

Also be aware that, for some of the more common mental health conditions (eg. depressive/ anxiety/ sleep disorders), this isn't a great time of year (length of days, vitamin D) and feeling out of control is a trigger. Some of the behaviours you mention is look-in-the-mirror familiar, other behaviours I have been around frequently.

Continue to be agreeable and non-committal, ask your sibling for suggestions as to the way forwards rather than coming up with plans and proposals yourself. I agree bounce onto the executor or solicitor wherever possible.

🙏 I know a lot of stuff about a lot of stuff health-wise, if I can help please ask. 🙏

DepositSaver

Just an update on this (and some more confusion about how things work). The executor has now renounced, as I expected. However there was another executor named, who died a few years ago. The solicitor has said they need a copy if his death certificate and has suggested we contact the his family members as listed in the death notice on the local paper website. We don't know this family and I had I think met the executor once quite a few years ago, and we have no contact details for them. There is a company the executor used to own and run - I could phone this company up and see if the family are still involved and if not can ask if they have contact info, but if they aren't involved or there are no contact details what do I do then? Do I just google the names in the death notice to try to find any info? The executor's surname was quite common so any sons may be hard to find, and I think the death notice indicates that daughters are married so may have a different name.

If I can track them down, are they obliged to arrange a copy of the death certificate? (presumably I would need to send them money to pay for this?) Could they refuse? It would feel very weird phoning someone I've never met, telling them their deceased relative was executor of my dad's will, and asking them to get a copy of his death certificate for me. Is this normal practice? 

Grumpelstiltskin

The dead executer. Did he live in England or Wales ?
Copy death certificates can be bought online.
General Register Office (GRO) - Official information on births, marriages, civil partnerships and deaths
So as long as you have enough information you can get a copy.