BITCOIN

Zola.

Reaper said:

I'm no crypto fan but I wouldn't entirely rule out investing if the market falls far enough. Not yet though because I'm expecting there is going to be another fall when El Salvador inevitably abandons Bitcoin and in doing so kills the idea off for other countries waiting to see the outcome of the experiment. I gather the IMF has indicated it won't give them any loans until they do (link).

I am curious how they pay their tax out there. Does the government tell you how much you owe in both bitcoin and fiat? If so I would delay paying until the last moment then pay with whichever was the least, which could save you a massive amount of money (and cost the government lots)!

Why is it inevitable they will abandon? It's not.
IMF are complaining because it threatens the very power they have on these type of developing nations.  It's also interesting to see folks like the Bank of England commenting about El Salvador with 'concerns', as if they ever gave a hoot before. 

If El Salvador continue as they are,  and their bitcoin bond deal is very profitable, you can be sure other nations will copy this playbook. Then things will get really interesting...

Malthusian

Zola. said:

Why is it inevitable they will abandon? It's not.
IMF are complaining because it threatens the very power they have on these type of developing nations. 

That power they have being the power to lend them money at interest they won't get anywhere else. El Salvador resenting the IMF is no different from a profligate individual blaming their credit card lender for their position instead of their own expenditure.

Bitcoin only reduces the power of the IMF if bros are more willing to lend El Salvador money on better terms than the IMF, and enough of it to prop up the Salvadorean economy. Given that Bitcoin bros, unlike the IMF, have no interest in the long-term stability of the Salvadorean economy and will be concerned solely with making a profit, and have considerably less money available to lend than the IMF, it's difficult to see that being a long-term proposition.

If El Salvador need either dollars or Bitcoin to pay their soldiers and civil servants, it's off to the IMF they go, and they'll dump the Bitcoin law like an ugly baby. (Bear in mind that it is exactly as difficult if not more difficult for El Salvador to acquire Bitcoin as US dollars. In the absence of loans which we've already discussed, they either need to export something or receive a remittance from outside. Sovereign citizens paying $100,000 in BTC for a Salvadorean passport won't boost the coffers much.)

If El Salvador continue as they are,  and their bitcoin bond deal is very profitable, you can be sure other nations will copy this playbook. Then things will get really interesting...

Given that Bitcoin has dumped 33% since they adopted Bitcoin as a currency, good luck with that "profitability".

If El Salvador had managed to borrow any Bitcoin they'd be laughing (as servicing the loan is now 33% cheaper) but in the absence of some reliable macroeconomic data on how much the country has borrowed in Bitcoin I'm sceptical that it will make much difference. Most of the coverage has focused on El Salvadoreans being paid in Bitcoin (which would have been mostly acquired by El Salvador converting US dollars) and using it as a medium of exchange. (Where Bitcoin does have some value in El Salvador, unlike in the West, due to the scarcity of more stable currencies such as USD.) We know that El Salvador has been buying and hodling Bitcoin in order to pay its employees and in an attempt to pump the price back up, which will almost certainly outweigh any gains from having borrowed it.

Zola.

Bit too early to be judging if its been a success, given its only been a few months... 
We will know more clearly in 5 years time after the lockup..

https://www.reuters.com/markets/rates-bonds/el-salvador-plans-first-bitcoin-city-backed-by-bitcoin-bonds-2021-11-21/

lozzy1965

Zola. said:

Bit too early to be judging if its been a success, given its only been a few months... 
We will know more clearly in 5 years time after the lockup..

https://www.reuters.com/markets/rates-bonds/el-salvador-plans-first-bitcoin-city-backed-by-bitcoin-bonds-2021-11-21/

I think we'll know whether bitcoin has been a success, or not, in El Salvador before 5 years is up.

He looks like a happenin' dude with his base ball cap on doesn't he

Thrugelmir

Reaper said:

I'm no crypto fan but I wouldn't entirely rule out investing if the market falls far enough.

Any good at catching falling knives? 

Zola.

lozzy1965 said:

Zola. said:

Bit too early to be judging if its been a success, given its only been a few months... 
We will know more clearly in 5 years time after the lockup..

https://www.reuters.com/markets/rates-bonds/el-salvador-plans-first-bitcoin-city-backed-by-bitcoin-bonds-2021-11-21/

I think we'll know whether bitcoin has been a success, or not, in El Salvador before 5 years is up.

He looks like a happenin' dude with his base ball cap on doesn't he

Haha he certainly is.. he's a bit more refreshing than the standard boring suited leader.. jury is out on him though no doubt..

Adyinvestment

Regards to the country game theory...

Russia looks likely to be regulating Bitcoin mining (weren't they banning it a few days ago ) - Putin is backing this.

Matt Hancock stood up in the commons yesterday calling for the UK to be the home of Fintech and Cryptocurrency, this seemed well received.

If Bitcoin is a Ponzi scheme then you have to admit its a damn good one! 

Aegis

Adyinvestment said:

Matt Hancock stood up in the commons yesterday calling for the UK to be the home of Fintech and Cryptocurrency, this seemed well received.

Oh great, if Matt Hancock is getting involved it has almost no hope of succeeding!

grumiofoundation

Aegis said:

Adyinvestment said:

Matt Hancock stood up in the commons yesterday calling for the UK to be the home of Fintech and Cryptocurrency, this seemed well received.

Oh great, if Matt Hancock is getting involved it has almost no hope of succeeding!

Guess that means we will hear of his next door neighbour bringing out a new coin soon then? 

Hexane

Scottex99 said:

I’m no expert, but I know a thing or two. I also know your money is better off in the market than in a bank. Go SHIB!

I wish I could troll this good

Hey kid, you were the one saying a few months ago, that BTC would go to US$100,000 within a few months.

Are you sure that no-one believed you? Because the people that made money, made it off the back of people who bought based on that nonsense you peddled.

So if no-one believed you, then good...