BITCOIN

tebbins

Zola. said:

Investing isn't a group project where we all win, there are always winners and losers between buyers and sellers. Stocks are no different.  If you hold long enough onto the right asset, you typically win.

Let's go back as far as google BTC pricing will let me.... today that's November 20th, 2015.  The fact of the matter is if I spent £1000 back then it would have bought me 5 Bitcoin. Today that value is £220,365. I sure wish I was a "crypto bro" back then, and if people here were honest with themselves, they'll have regretted missing that opportunity too. 

You're literally just saying "hindsight and market timing would have been great".
Two words: survivor bias

Were you even owning any coins in 2015?

Malthusian

adindas said:

This just my general view regarding using an IFA services, I am not refering to a particular  IFA.

To me I do not need to pay a financial advisor just to tell me to invest in treasury Bond earning about 1.5 % a year.

In term of stock, I also do not need a financial advisor telling me to invest in index fund S&P 500, FTSE 100, Vanguard Life Strategy, Vanguard Target Retirement Fund, etc either.

If I use an IFA I am expecting my money to beat the index fund to grow at least 30%+ a year.

In the field of realistic expectations, that's not far off going into a solicitor's offices for some help with estate planning, and saying that I expect them to make me live forever. 

The point of paying a financial adviser is to receive financial advice, not to make free money (and certainly not to get rich quick, which is what returns of 30%pa are) by outperforming the index by more than their fees.

adindas

Malthusian said:

adindas said:

This just my general view regarding using an IFA services, I am not refering to a particular  IFA.

To me I do not need to pay a financial advisor just to tell me to invest in treasury Bond earning about 1.5 % a year.

In term of stock, I also do not need a financial advisor telling me to invest in index fund S&P 500, FTSE 100, Vanguard Life Strategy, Vanguard Target Retirement Fund, etc either.

If I use an IFA I am expecting my money to beat the index fund to grow at least 30%+ a year.

In the field of realistic expectations, that's not far off going into a solicitor's offices for some help with estate planning, and saying that I expect them to make me live forever. 

The point of paying a financial adviser is to receive financial advice, not to make free money (and certainly not to get rich quick, which is what returns of 30%pa are) by outperforming the index by more than their fees.

What probably some people are not aware of because they keep living in their own compound is that there are REASONABLE number of active retail investors constantly get 30%+ year after year. So expecting to get the return of 30%+ is not like expecting people to make you living forever. Thanks to major cryptos, good high growth stock, near zero fee platform for trading and investing such as eToro, Trading 212, Robinhood, Freetrade, WeBull, Stake, MooMoo, etc. Thanks to real-time analytical tools, stock market news which some are now available free of charge.

You see the same reaction here when people start talking about BTC in this thread. Just because BTC provide a return of  (+7,734.91%) within five years, do not thave a traditional value like staples, food (because you could not eat it) it does not have a P/E ratio like a value stock then it must be a scam.

adindas

Zola. said:

Investing isn't a group project where we all win, there are always winners and losers between buyers and sellers. Stocks are no different.  If you hold long enough onto the right asset, you typically win.

Let's go back as far as google BTC pricing will let me.... today that's November 20th, 2015.  The fact of the matter is if I spent £1000 back then it would have bought me 5 Bitcoin. Today that value is £220,365. I sure wish I was a "crypto bro" back then, and if people here were honest with themselves, they'll have regretted missing that opportunity too. 

I know the feeling if you think you have missed the gravy train, you have missed the boat lol

bugbyte_2

Most importantly some people are refering to what Warren Buffet and Charlie Munger are saying regarding Bitcoin. ..................................

A good example is Amazon. The company hardly making any profit in the early day as they was investing for growth, reinvesting revenue they have made to expand the business. Acquire other companies to accelerate the expansion and grow like an octopus. It only made its first profit in the fourth quarter of 2001: $0.01 (i.e., 1¢ per share), on revenues of more than $1 billion.

Facebook did similar thing Acquire other companies to accelerate the expansion, only start making profit in 2004.

Many people could not see the future value of something. Those who could see the future, have invested on both companies since in the early day where there were not a lot of people pay attention, understand the future value of something, what they will create, see where they are now!!!

WHO?

WHO apart from your good self keeps posting about WB and CM? is there a MoneySavingExpert Buffett appreciation thread I have completely missed? Has Munger done something unspeakably bad to your cat for you to keep bringing his name up? Every other post you mention them, plus the hordes of non existent posters who apparently keep bringing them up.

Secondly, whats your point? Lets name a couple of companies that have been successful whilst completely ignoring the literally thousands of other companies that also didn't make a profit in the early days and guess what? they never made a profit and then popped out of existence. What can I say? I personally lent Mark Zuckerberg his seed money? about as probable as saying I put my life savings on Bitcoin in 2015 - wasn't I clever? 

adindas

bugbyte_2 said:

WHO?

WHO apart from your good self keeps posting about WB and CM? is there a MoneySavingExpert Buffett appreciation thread I have completely missed? Has Munger done something unspeakably bad to your cat for you to keep bringing his name up? Every other post you mention them, plus the hordes of non existent posters who apparently keep bringing them up.

Secondly, whats your point? Lets name a couple of companies that have been successful whilst completely ignoring the literally thousands of other companies that also didn't make a profit in the early days and guess what? they never made a profit and then popped out of existence. What can I say? I personally lent Mark Zuckerberg his seed money? about as probable as saying I put my life savings on Bitcoin in 2015 - wasn't I clever? 

The discussion becomes the dialogue of the deaf when another person is arguing a lot, talking a lot of bla bla bla (like Gretha Thurnberg has decribed it); start accusing another person is making it up, liying but he does not do his own homework.

It took me sometimes to find it out but you have got do something preventing people might call you a liar. Just imagine when the original poster has deleted his original post. I will remain as a liar in this thread

The second point is another dialogue of the deaf. I will just throw out these buzzwords.

Bitcoin vs Shitcoin

OTC Penny stocks P&D vs Blockbuster IPOs of high growth stocks

Nikola Vs Tesla

Real time information vs Hard copies of Newspapers delivered by snailmail in the past

DDs

Risk vs Rewards

You take that decision in every aspect of your life. You took that decision when you choose between Investing vs Saving, LT investing vs Short Term Investing. Put your money into saving nothing wrong with it as long as you are not complaining when you get <1% interest per annum, while some people might get that in less than a week.

I am not saying everyone could figure it out. But the final phrase is that “Fortune favours the brave” like this video clip featured with Matt Damon.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9hBC5TVdYT8

Hexane

darren232002 said:

Hexane said:

That was on 13th April 2021. Six months down the line, BTC seems to be at around $59,000

So it's gone basically nowhere in that time, other than down a lot and back up again.

Need another "few months"?

This will not age well

I know right.

So in April it was going to US$100,000 in "a few months", in October it was around $59,000 ... and now it's around $60,000

we need a few months more I guess

Malthusian

adindas said:

What probably some people are not aware of because they keep living in their own compound is that there are REASONABLE number of active retail investors constantly get 30%+ year after year. So expecting to get the return of 30%+ is not like expecting people to make you living forever. Thanks to major cryptos, good high growth stock, near zero fee platform for trading and investing such as eToro, Trading 212, Robinhood, Freetrade, WeBull, Stake, MooMoo, etc.

If you can find enough bros who think it's reasonable to lose a sum equivalent to a third of your hodlings every year, year in year out, solely so that you can get rich quick, then all power to you. Punters' money in == punters' money out.

FAOD, if you can invest a mere £10,000 at age 30 and cash out just shy of £2 million at 50, or just under £100 million at 65, that = getting rich quick.

MATT DAMON!

Zola.

Every single person who has held bitcoin for four years has made money, often significant sums of money. Those who panic sold in the inevitable cycle dips usually lost money. 

tebbins

Zola. said:

Every single person who has held bitcoin for four years has made money, often significant sums of money. Those who panic sold in the inevitable cycle dips usually lost money. 

Again, market timing and selecting a specific time period with an extremely endpoint sensitive asset.