UPDATE: Moving house - Europcar admin fee & awaiting NtH from Premier Parking Solutions HELP

twhitehousescat

in the event that Europcar receives a notice or correspondence relating to a fine, penalty or toll, which has either been sent by an issuing authority or private car parking company;

do nthe terms and conditions you signed include the words private car parking company; or have they just added this  at later letter stage 

I also wonder about  fine, penalty or toll,

Were_Doomed

As I said in this post I fear they've gotten wise to the difference between penalties and charges and have this covered in their T&Cs. Thus an admin charge may be justifiable. Whether £40 is justifiable is another matter ... it won't take a (probable) minimum wage employee 2+ hours to generate that letter to the PPC and attach a copy of the hire agreement - it can be done in 30 minutes tops - so they're profiteering on the back of a speculative invoice from a 3rd party. (Remember also that said employee is already being paid regardless of whether this activity is required to be done or not).

OnTheRoadAgain2000

Were_Doomed said:

As I said in this post I fear they've gotten wise to the difference between penalties and charges and have this covered in their T&Cs. Thus an admin charge may be justifiable. Whether £40 is justifiable is another matter ... it won't take a (probable) minimum wage employee 2+ hours to generate that letter to the PPC and attach a copy of the hire agreement - it can be done in 30 minutes tops - so they're profiteering on the back of a speculative invoice from a 3rd party. (Remember also that said employee is already being paid regardless of whether this activity is required to be done or not).

twhitehousescat said:

in the event that Europcar receives a notice or correspondence relating to a fine, penalty or toll, which has either been sent by an issuing authority or private car parking company;
do nthe terms and conditions you signed include the words private car parking company; or have they just added this  at later letter stage 

They are wise to it, you are correct:

"Where the term ‘issuing body’ is used in this section 9.3.1 it can apply to any, or all, of the following organisations: • police or other enforcement agencies or other issuing authorities where a driving offence or suspected driving offence has been committed during a Hire Period; and • either a public or a private enforcement agency that is entitled to issue parking charge notices and associated fines where a purported or actual breach of contract has arisen."

So, in some respects, I am bang to rights given I signed the T&Cs, but it still feels maasively vague and broad, covering any cowboy operator.

However, you are also right that £40 is speculative profiteering. The £10 admin fee train companies charge for changing a ticket is too much, but I may have just paid that to be done with Europcar.

I'm a freelancer myself. The amount of time I've sunk into this dispute with them, I feel like invoicing Europcar for a day's work.

OnTheRoadAgain2000

Coupon-mad said:

I would take it to the BVRLA, personally.  Europcar also lied to you by saying that they had already passed on your details to PPS, but instead they sat on it for more weeks then finally wrote to PPS.  And as you say, this is not a 'penalty, fine or toll', all of which have specific statutory meanings and can never be collected by a private parking ex-clamper thug firm.
Also, companies can;t add 'late payment charges' to alleged debts if the person is a consumer.  The Late Payment Regs only relate to business-to-business cases.

This is really useful. Thanks Coupon-mad.

They also lied about another issue. Europcar charged me £3.20 straight after the end of the hire without informing me. The lady in the Philippines in customer services couldn't tell me what it for. Europcar then apologised, then changed their mind and said it was for a late return, and have since apologised again (over two months after the unauthorised charge) and said they would refund after I pointed out this was all not true.

twhitehousescat

but no private parking co is an "agency" ask them agency of WHOM , and remind them no privaate company can issue fines 

Half_way

One issue is that if the parking charge was issued incorrectly, as in a double dip, residential or something like non compliance with PoFA then the hire co could possibly be In a spot of trouble if it passes on details without checking, or charges an admin fee.
The fact that private parking (unlike council issued tickets) is unregulated should be enough to cause concern add to how hire company's handle ppc issues

OnTheRoadAgain2000

Half_way said:

One issue is that if the parking charge was issued incorrectly, as in a double dip, residential or something like non compliance with PoFA then the hire co could possibly be In a spot of trouble if it passes on details without checking, or charges an admin fee.

Interesting. Could you expand on that a little? In a spot of trouble in what way?

OnTheRoadAgain2000

twhitehousescat said:

but no private parking co is an "agency" ask them agency of WHOM , and remind them no privaate company can issue fines 

I'll certainly remind them of that, thanks twhitehousescat.
However, are they not an agency in light of the fact they have a relationship with a car park owner and have authority to act on their behalf?
I know they are not an agency in the sense of the police or council.

twhitehousescat

step back , your first post and crap from eurocar 

‘A person or organization hiring a vehicle from a hire company is responsible for parking charges during the hire period if they have signed an agreement with the hire company accepting liability. The hire company cannot be liable for unpaid parking charges during the period of hire if they provide a copy of the relevant hire agreement documents to the landholder within 28 days of receiving a ‘notice to keeper’ in the post’.

have they sent the required info to the LANDOWNER 

i think not , they have failed to complty with there side of the contract 

game over , they pay 

ask them for proof of posting , seeinng as yhou paid an office juniour a weeks wage 

OnTheRoadAgain2000

twhitehousescat said:

‘A person or organization hiring a vehicle from a hire company is responsible for parking charges during the hire period if they have signed an agreement with the hire company accepting liability. The hire company cannot be liable for unpaid parking charges during the period of hire if they provide a copy of the relevant hire agreement documents to the landholder within 28 days of receiving a ‘notice to keeper’ in the post’.
have they sent the required info to the LANDOWNER 
i think not , they have failed to complty with there side of the contract 
game over , they pay 
ask them for proof of posting , seeinng as yhou paid an office juniour a weeks wage 

Ahhhh, very interesting.
Thank you for pointing this out. I had forgot they said this in the original reply.