Only first letter of number plate entered - Quick response would be appreciated PCN Appeal

Kingmonkey77

Ok great thanks. I thought I could kill two birds with one stone and put it all in one letter but I'll do it in two as suggested.

D_P_Dance

 This is the sort of.. time wasting claim that annoys many  judges, read this

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/De_minimis#:~:text=De minimis is a Latin,refuses to consider trifling matters.

i

Kingmonkey77

D_P_Dance said:

 This is the sort of.. time wasting claim that annoys many  judges, read this

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/De_minimis#:~:text=De minimis is a Latin,refuses to consider trifling matters.

i

Thanks for your reply, much appreciated

Coupon-mad

And this weekend: An urgent task – deadline is MONDAY!

Please now make a real difference because not enough people have yet, and time is running out.  

The Government is consulting for just a few more days, about a new statutory code of practice (CoP) and framework intended to rein in the rogue parking firms. 

Does it go far enough?  Read and comment on the draft CoP proposal and the enforcement framework consultation (two separate consultation documents). 

HOW TO DO THE SUBMISSIONS:

BSI PAS 232 – COMMENTING ON THE CODE OF PRACTICE AS DRAFTED :

1. You will need to register then log in, to comment on the CoP and enter an occupation even if you are retired or a homemaker.  

2. Register, log into the BSI page, and download & read the cover letter here:

https://standardsdevelopment.bsigroup.com/projects/2020-00193#/section

3. Read the cover letter again and note the suggested extra questions... if you agree that, say, the 'loading/unloading and dropping off, asking for directions, and disabled people parking on double yellows as they can on street' activities listed should be exempt (not parking events, what do you think?) then please go to the Annexes at the end of the PAS Code and find the one about Exempt Vehicles and state what other activity you think should be added to the exempt list. 

 

4. Download the PAS itself and start commenting on what you wish to say something about.  Quick links to each section appear on the left of your page.  

You don’t have to comment on everything, e.g. you might want to skip the definitions and focus on later sections, and certainly look at the Annex tables at the end that show things like consideration & grace periods and exemptions.

5. Submit comments when you are happy with them. Don’t just ‘SAVE’ and forget!

THAT IS HALF THE JOB DONE!

THE MHCLG CONSULTATION IS EASIER AS IT IS JUST A LIST OF QUESTIONS.  

6. You can do it first if preferred or pushed for time:

https://forms.office.com/Pages/ResponsePage.aspx?id=EGg0v32c3kOociSi7zmVqAVPfAOtwRxLhHRwQ610oElUMzhQSVo0WUQ4SERVSEZaUU9DTUhFQ1VMUy4u

If your answers exceed 4000 characters (approx. 500 words to a single question or 16000 words (approx. 2500 words) for all the questions below, you can email your answers to parking@communities.gov.uk as long as you state who you are.

THESE ARE THE QUESTIONS YOU WILL SEE, FOR RESPONSES TO THE FRAMEWORK:

Q1 Do you agree or disagree that members of APAs should be required to use a single appeals service appointed by the Secretary of State? 

Strongly agree/Somewhat agree/Neither agree nor disagree/Somewhat disagree/Strongly disagree 

Q1.1 Please explain your answer 

(free text)

Q2 Please provide any other feedback on the determination of appeals, including the funding model and features that an appeal service should offer e.g. telephone or in-person hearings, the ability to submit evidence online 

(free text)

Q3 Please provide any comments you have on the proposal to enforce the Code by combining the ATA’s existing audit procedures with additional safeguards. 

(free text)

Q4 Please outline any alternative means by which the Code could be monitored and enforced. You may wish to cite evidence from other regulatory frameworks which are relevant. 

(free text)

Q5 Please provide any feedback you have on the proposed governance arrangements for monitoring the new Code of Practice 

(free text)

Q6 Which parking charge system is most appropriate for private parking?

 a) the Three-tiered system

 b) Mirroring the Local Authority system

(free text)

 Q6.1 Please explain your answer. You may, for example, wish to make reference to other deterrent frameworks (for example, for railway tickets or traffic violations) 

(free text)

Q7 What level of discount is appropriate: 

40% as is currently offered in private parking and suggested in the three-tiered system, or 

50% as is offered in Local Authority parking? 

a) 40% 

b) 50% 

Q7.1 Please explain your answer, including whether the discount should be set at a different level 

(free text)

 Q8 How should the level of parking charges be set and how should the levels be revised in future? 

(free text)

Q9 Do you agree or disagree in principle with the idea of the Appeals Charter? 

Agree/Disagree 

Q9.1 Please explain your answer 

(free text)

Q10 Do you agree or not that the examples given in the Appeals Charter are fair and appropriate? Agree/Disagree 

Q10.1 Please explain your answer. 

You may wish, for example, to suggest additional cases to be covered in an Appeals Charter or query existing examples. 

(free text)

Q11 Do you agree or disagree that the parking industry should contribute towards the cost of the regulation? 

Agree/Disagree 

Q11.1 Please explain your answer.

(free text)

YOU CAN INSTEAD GIVE MORE CONCISE ANSWERS ONLINE, USING THE MHCLG PAGE LINK.

Don’t forget that answering these questions is the easier bit…

Looking at the BSI PAS (the draft code of practice itself) involves logging in and submitting comments again, and again and again and takes more time!

There is a discussion about PAS submissions and what the pages look like, here:

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/6195417/am-i-doing-something-wrong/p1

Kingmonkey77

Hi. I was wondering if I could get some thought on the updated situation I find myself in.

On 08 October I emailed both PPS and BWL.

I sent a SAR to PPS and in a separate letter also sent a copy of the ticket I paid for and asked them to explain what all the information on the ticket represents. I also asked them for a PDT machine record of the day in question covering the times I made my payment.

On 14 October I received my SAR back but included was a letter saying I had asked for information that was not personal so I would have to request it through BWL.

On 20 October I sent the request for the information to BWL.

On 27 October I received an email from BWL in response to my email dated 08 October, not the one dated 20 October saying 

"I write in reference to your email dated 08 October 2020.

Summary

The contravention occurred on 31 January 2020 (Contravention Date), where the vehicle bearing the registration XXXXX (Vehicle) was parked on private land i.e XXXXX managed by our client Premier Parking Solutions Limited. The car park is operated by automatic number plate-recognition cameras (ANPR) which captured the vehicle entering the car park at 11:28am and exiting at 13:10pm.

As there were no trace of payment, our client obtained your client’s full name and serviceable address of XXXXXXXXX from the hirer company XXXXXXXXX, and as such, all documents issued by our client were sent there, including the Notice to Hirer dated 24 February 2020.

We are aware that you appealed this matter which was submitted on 27 February 2020 confirming that you had a valid ticket displayed on the dashboard, however the machine would not let you input your full registration number. Our client responded to your appeal on 28 February 2020 confirming that only authorised users can park on the site in question which is displayed on the terms and conditions when you enter the car park. Our client also confirmed that an active ANPR camera was operating at the site at the time of the contravention and they have fully searched their systems and they are unable to find any payment to authorise the parking of the vehicle registration MT68 EPF.

They also confirmed that they have checked their records and no other problems with inputting vehicle registrations were occurred on that date and gave you an extra 14 days to pay the initial sum of the Parking Charge Notice (PCN) of £60.00.

Response

As per your email, you have provided proof that you have paid for parking. As confirmed, our Client’s records show no registration number that bears any resemblance to your Vehicle's registration number. In the terms and conditions, you will note that it states “When paying by phone or when required to enter a vehicle registration to authorise parking, full and exact details must be entered correctly”. Due to the Car Park being operated by the use of ANPR cameras, the camera records all incoming and outgoing vehicle registration numbers, and when purchasing a ticket, the full registration is inputted so it can match with the data received from the PDT machines. By your action of either failing to enter the Vehicle's correct registration number, or by failing to make payment at all, you have failed to make a valid payment for parking and thus have breached the terms and conditions.

The use of ANPR cameras is contingent upon motorists entering their full and accurate vehicle registration numbers. Our Client cannot allocate the period of parking to the Vehicle if the correct registration was not entered at the time of making payment. This is therefore a core term of the Terms and Conditions.

Further to this, on the signage there is our clients telephone number displayed, if you were experiencing problems with entering your vehicle’s registration number you should have contacted our client to discuss this with a member of their staff.

Therefore as per the above, it is our position that the PCN was issued correctly. A Claim was issued against you on 26 October 2020 and deemed served 02 November 2020.

Next Steps

As a claim has been issued, if no contact is received in regards to the outstanding balance we will be at liberty to enter a County Court Judgment (CCJ) against you. In order to avoid this you can call us on 0113 323 1784 within 14 days from the date of this email to set up an affordable payment arrangement which is suitable for you.

Alternatively, you can use our website www.bwlegal.co.uk to set up the arrangement. Our customer portal provides you with the functionality to speak to us by webchat, complete your income and expenditure or make a payment.

If you do not wish to set up a payment arrangement in regards to the above balance, please respond to the claim form accordingly which will be deemed served on 02 November 2020.

I trust this is in order and look forward to hearing from you.

Yours Sincerely"


Today I have had the county court claim forms arrive at home. I called BWL and asked why they have filed the claim on the 26th October when the haven't responded to my email of 20th October and all they said is that they have been busy and working reduced hours during covid. They have said they will deal with my email as quickly as they can and supply the information as soon as possible but I'm not really sure what to do now. Obviously I will reply to the courts and dispute the charge as I did pay for a ticket but the machine only printed the first letter of my VRN on it so I will fill in the defence and counterclaim part but perviously on this thread people have said this is winnable so would the advice be to do what I'm doing still??

I've never had court dealings before so any help or advice would be great.

Thanks in advance.

KeithP

What is the Issue Date on your County Court Claim Form?

Kingmonkey77

KeithP said:

What is the Issue Date on your County Court Claim Form?

Hi. The issue date is 26 October 2020

KeithP

Kingmonkey77 said:

KeithP said:

What is the Issue Date on your County Court Claim Form?

Hi. The issue date is 26 October 2020

With a Claim Issue Date of 26th October, you have until Monday 16th November to file an Acknowledgment of Service. If possible, do not file an AoS before 31st October, but otherwise, there is nothing to be gained by delaying it. 

To file an AoS, follow the guidance in the Dropbox file linked from the second post in the NEWBIES thread.

Having filed an AoS, you have until 4pm on Monday 30th November 2020 to file your Defence.

That's over four weeks away. Plenty of time to produce a Defence, but please don't leave it to the last minute.

To create a Defence, and then file a Defence by email, look again at the second post on the NEWBIES thread - immediately following where you found the Acknowledgment of Service instructions.

Don't miss the deadline for filing an Acknowledgment of Service, nor that for filing a Defence.

Kingmonkey77

KeithP said:

Kingmonkey77 said:

KeithP said:

What is the Issue Date on your County Court Claim Form?

Hi. The issue date is 26 October 2020

With a Claim Issue Date of 26th October, you have until Monday 16th November to file an Acknowledgment of Service. If possible, do not file an AoS before 31st October, but otherwise, there is nothing to be gained by delaying it. 

To file an AoS, follow the guidance in the Dropbox file linked from the second post in the NEWBIES thread.

Having filed an AoS, you have until 4pm on Monday 30th November 2020 to file your Defence.

That's over four weeks away. Plenty of time to produce a Defence, but please don't leave it to the last minute.

To create a Defence, and then file a Defence by email, look again at the second post on the NEWBIES thread - immediately following where you found the Acknowledgment of Service instructions.

Don't miss the deadline for filing an Acknowledgment of Service, nor that for filing a Defence.

Thank you. I've got some time off coming up luckily so I'll be able to take a bit of time over it.
BW Legal have said in their email that they will be at liberty to enter a county court judgement against me if I don't contact them to arrange payment. Obviously I don't want a CCJ hanging over me but can they do that before it's been to court?

Coupon-mad

Yes if you fail to defend!