Can I be forced to have a smart meter?

MWT

James_Freebourne said:

MWT said:

James_Freebourne said:

...putting a meter into 'dumb' mode will probably not stop it receiving and activating the revised unit charge, so not really dumb.

Changing the unit price on a smart meter has zero impact on your bill...

If you are not on a tariff that has different rates for different times of day then you will not be charged for them no matter what has been sent to the smart meter.

MWT, you missed my point.  If the meter had been put into 'dumb' mode, how come it's making any changes?  Furthermore, if a firmware update had 'dumb' mode disabled by default, then applying that update to a meter in 'dumb' mode would turn off the 'dumb' mode, thus allowing the meter to restart sending readings without the homeowners' knowledge or consent.

Not missed your point, you are just referencing something that doesn't exist any more, if it ever did...

The ship has sailed on the matter of half-hour data access, it is a requirement for the Market-wide Half Hour Settlement system that is in the process of being rolled out.

Customers can still opt not to have the data used for their billing, but the supplier will, and before long must, use that data for settlement, which is the process by which suppliers account for the energy used by their customers. 

Qyburn

QrizB said:

James_Freebourne said:

A National Grid engineer once explained like this - think concert ticket pricing.  Demand is low, so the prices are low.  As demand goes up, so do prices (for everyone) - if demand drops, prices fall again.

Surge pricing.

"Surge Pricing" is the term bandied about by scaremongering conspiracy theorists. There is simply no mechanism for enforcing time of use pricing on anyone who hasn't chosen to actively sign up for such a tariff. 

Said scaremongering conspiracy theorists have this stupid idea that if such a thing ever came about then you'd be immune if you don't have a smart meter. The reality is, if it ever came about, that people refusing smart meters would just be put on the peak rate 24/7.

Qyburn

James_Freebourne said:

My comments on burst charging seem to have caused a little confusion.  With a time-of-day tariffs like Economy7, the unit charge changes at fixed (and known) times of the day or night - burst charging does not work this way.

That's because there's no such thing.

MeteredOut

James_Freebourne said:

My comments on burst charging seem to have caused a little confusion.  With a time-of-day tariffs like Economy7, the unit charge changes at fixed (and known) times of the day or night - burst charging does not work this way.
A National Grid engineer once explained like this - think concert ticket pricing.  Demand is low, so the prices are low.  As demand goes up, so do prices (for everyone) - if demand drops, prices fall again.
Another analogy he mentioned is the FA Cup final.  Everyone watching takes a break to go put the kettle on, increasing demand; so the cost of electricity goes up at that point.  With the second half now underway, demand falls, so so do costs - utterly dynamic; and impossible for the homeowner to budget for.

There is certainly some confusion going on here. Can you provide a link to the details of this burst charging please, specifically how it relates to UK energy pricing.

It's not a term I've heard before and it sounds like a "someone down the pub told me" type of thing.

armistice

James_Freebourne said:

As a final point, the in-house display is only guaranteed for 1-2 years and when it fails, the energy supplier is under no obligation to replace it, since the meter itself is still working fine - the homeowner needs to purchase a new display - they don't tell you that.

You don't need an in house display, if your supplied one did fail (and few do) , theres little reason to buy a new one.

karenjdot

I have been with Octopus for some years, they are sending me emails saying my electricity meter has now reached the end of it’s certification period and I must schedule an installation of a smart meter. I live in a rural area where I often do not receive telephone calls on my mobile.  I envisage, although I may be wrong, that having a smart meter is going to be problematic, and having read on this website that I can request once installed, dumb mode, and I simply give my month readings, which I have always done anyway. Octopus have just told me ahead of the installation that that is not correct, they do not do this unless for any reason it becomes a problem but they won’t do this if I request it in the first instance. I fear that this may be a lengthy and time consuming problem for me having heard on radio 4 so many people speak about how drawn out the process is if they don’t work as they should.

EssexHebridean

karenjdot said:

I have been with Octopus for some years, they are sending me emails saying my electricity meter has now reached the end of it’s certification period and I must schedule an installation of a smart meter. I live in a rural area where I often do not receive telephone calls on my mobile.  I envisage, although I may be wrong, that having a smart meter is going to be problematic, and having read on this website that I can request once installed, dumb mode, and I simply give my month readings, which I have always done anyway. Octopus have just told me ahead of the installation that that is not correct, they do not do this unless for any reason it becomes a problem but they won’t do this if I request it in the first instance. I fear that this may be a lengthy and time consuming problem for me having heard on radio 4 so many people speak about how drawn out the process is if they don’t work as they should.

The answer in your situation is to have the new meter installed as you will need to anyway. if it connects, and sends readings, bonus. if it does not - at least initially, then you continue giving readings as normal. It doesn't need to be any more comp0lex than that - if the meter cannot send readings, regardless of what frighteners you may have heard in the media, it's almost certainly not going to leave you any worse off! 

debitcardmayhem

How many people do radio 4 ask about their successful meters?. The problem with the media is good stories don’t make good headlines. Having a smart meter allows you to have access to tariffs which may save you money.

Spoonie_Turtle

debitcardmayhem said:

How many people do radio 4 ask about their successful meters?. The problem with the media is good stories don’t make good headlines. Having a smart meter allows you to have access to tariffs which may save you money.

Just for the sake of accuracy, having a *communicating smart meter allows access to tariffs which save money.

But a non-communicating one will leave the previous poster in the same kind of situation they are now, having to take readings every month just as they already are. 
They'll be in a better position overall than they are now though, with a meter that can legally be used to bill against instead of having one with an expired certification period.  (And if it does start communicating in the future, great, they'll then be able access to tariffs that can save them money.)

TimeLord1

You will just get fed up of the constant letters and messages. Legally, it's not mandatory or compulsory, so you can decline. They'll use it as an issue for any savings or reductions. It's inevitable and done in two hours.