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Parking Eye - PCN issued - 'YourParkingSpace' used to book
Method_EU
Posts: 24 Forumite
Good afternoon,
On the 16th of July - I used 'YourParkingSpace' to book a parking space at Crowne Plaza hotel - Leeds. I usually book 8 to 9 hours on 'regular days' in the office - or 2 hours if I need to nip into the office and travel afterwards. On the day in question, I booked 2 hours but I had to work from home. I then transferred the booking (as you're eligible to do) within the app from my vehicle, to my partners as we work 10 minutes apart, hence we drive in together usually. The booking from that time on the YourParkingSpace app shows the VRN for my partners vehicle, therefore confirming the booking was changed from my vehicle, to hers. Ignorantly - I forgot to extend the booking as she would be in the area for longer than the 2 hours I originally booked. Per Parking Eye's scammy tactics, the usual happened, letters sent demanding payment. We ignored these - and now a court claim has been issued. Again, usual stuff. Yes, I now realise I should have taken action before this point. Willing to defend this in court.
The reason why I'm posting here is to see if we have any valid defence in regards to the glorified invoice Parking Eye have issued at this stage:
EDIT: The claim has not been brought against myself, rather my partners car.
- According to the YourParkingSpace Parking Contract, which I entered when making the booking (afraid I cannot attach links to my post apparently - easily found on the YourParkingSpace website however), I became "the driver" as per:
- Drivers. We refer in the Parking Contract to individuals who pay to park as Drivers, even if the person who pays to allow a vehicle to be parked in a parking space is not in fact the driver of that vehicle.
Even though the booking was made by myself with my account and payment method, then transferred the VRN to my partners, would I still be technically be "the driver" in this case?
Further to the YourParkingSpace Parking Contract, my argument is on the below points:
- No reliance on anything outside the Parking Contract. The Driver and the Space Owner acknowledge that the Parking Contract contains the whole agreement between the parties and each acknowledges that he or she has not relied upon any other statement (written or verbal) made by the other in entering into the Parking Contract, other than the Space Owner's description of the parking space included in the advertisement.
As per the Parking Contract with YourParkingSpace, The 'Space Owner' being Crowne Plaza Hotel - Leeds, 'Driver' being myself. No third party "contractor". In addition to this, the advertisement states (I have a screenshot of said advertisement) to ignore parking signs located at the site (I also have pictures of the signage if required). Nothing in the advertisement suggests that Parking Eye are contracted to monitor parking or that I should follow their T&C's. The advertisement simply states "your vehicle details have been loaded into the ANPR camera system in advance" and as mentioned above, to ignore the parking signs. Would this override any "contract" enforced in place at the venue?
I have contacted YourParkingSpace who are unwilling to cancel the PCN, point of note from the reply I got from themselves:
"I have received correspondence back from Parking Eye and I can confirm that your booking was fed through to Parking Eye's system when you initially made the booking with the VRN XXXXXX. When the vehicle was updated on the morning of your booking start time, the details had not been updated to Parking Eye which is why the paid duration is "0" on the online portal."
On the PE appeal page - as in the above statement, it shows NO booking was made when in fact, a booking was placed. Would this suggest there was a technical error with YourParkingSpace, not updating the details to Parking Eye (whom I believe they have integrated with in terms of registering a booked car on a "whitelist").
Further from YourParkingSpace:
"We have cancelled your booked parking space with us on the date in question as the vehicle had not fed through"
How can they cancel a historic booking? I have screenshot evidence of the booking, which shows the VRN as my partners, not VRN of the original car booked.
Further to contacting the above, I have done the following:
- Contacted the Landowner (Crowne Plaza). They said they cannot help, as the booking was made through a 3rd party (YourParkingSpace), and not via the reception terminal.
- Contacted YourParkingSpace CEO Harrison Woods voicing my displeasure on the situation and providing the background of the PCN issued. (Awaiting reply).
I may be missing out on further points of interest, I'll be re-reading YourParkingSpace T&C's in more detail later this evening.
Do I have any case here for my defence, should it come to court proceedings? Any advice would be greatly appreciated whilst I re-read the NEWBIE thread stickied.
On the 16th of July - I used 'YourParkingSpace' to book a parking space at Crowne Plaza hotel - Leeds. I usually book 8 to 9 hours on 'regular days' in the office - or 2 hours if I need to nip into the office and travel afterwards. On the day in question, I booked 2 hours but I had to work from home. I then transferred the booking (as you're eligible to do) within the app from my vehicle, to my partners as we work 10 minutes apart, hence we drive in together usually. The booking from that time on the YourParkingSpace app shows the VRN for my partners vehicle, therefore confirming the booking was changed from my vehicle, to hers. Ignorantly - I forgot to extend the booking as she would be in the area for longer than the 2 hours I originally booked. Per Parking Eye's scammy tactics, the usual happened, letters sent demanding payment. We ignored these - and now a court claim has been issued. Again, usual stuff. Yes, I now realise I should have taken action before this point. Willing to defend this in court.
The reason why I'm posting here is to see if we have any valid defence in regards to the glorified invoice Parking Eye have issued at this stage:
EDIT: The claim has not been brought against myself, rather my partners car.
- According to the YourParkingSpace Parking Contract, which I entered when making the booking (afraid I cannot attach links to my post apparently - easily found on the YourParkingSpace website however), I became "the driver" as per:
- Drivers. We refer in the Parking Contract to individuals who pay to park as Drivers, even if the person who pays to allow a vehicle to be parked in a parking space is not in fact the driver of that vehicle.
Even though the booking was made by myself with my account and payment method, then transferred the VRN to my partners, would I still be technically be "the driver" in this case?
Further to the YourParkingSpace Parking Contract, my argument is on the below points:
- No reliance on anything outside the Parking Contract. The Driver and the Space Owner acknowledge that the Parking Contract contains the whole agreement between the parties and each acknowledges that he or she has not relied upon any other statement (written or verbal) made by the other in entering into the Parking Contract, other than the Space Owner's description of the parking space included in the advertisement.
As per the Parking Contract with YourParkingSpace, The 'Space Owner' being Crowne Plaza Hotel - Leeds, 'Driver' being myself. No third party "contractor". In addition to this, the advertisement states (I have a screenshot of said advertisement) to ignore parking signs located at the site (I also have pictures of the signage if required). Nothing in the advertisement suggests that Parking Eye are contracted to monitor parking or that I should follow their T&C's. The advertisement simply states "your vehicle details have been loaded into the ANPR camera system in advance" and as mentioned above, to ignore the parking signs. Would this override any "contract" enforced in place at the venue?
I have contacted YourParkingSpace who are unwilling to cancel the PCN, point of note from the reply I got from themselves:
"I have received correspondence back from Parking Eye and I can confirm that your booking was fed through to Parking Eye's system when you initially made the booking with the VRN XXXXXX. When the vehicle was updated on the morning of your booking start time, the details had not been updated to Parking Eye which is why the paid duration is "0" on the online portal."
On the PE appeal page - as in the above statement, it shows NO booking was made when in fact, a booking was placed. Would this suggest there was a technical error with YourParkingSpace, not updating the details to Parking Eye (whom I believe they have integrated with in terms of registering a booked car on a "whitelist").
Further from YourParkingSpace:
"We have cancelled your booked parking space with us on the date in question as the vehicle had not fed through"
How can they cancel a historic booking? I have screenshot evidence of the booking, which shows the VRN as my partners, not VRN of the original car booked.
Further to contacting the above, I have done the following:
- Contacted the Landowner (Crowne Plaza). They said they cannot help, as the booking was made through a 3rd party (YourParkingSpace), and not via the reception terminal.
- Contacted YourParkingSpace CEO Harrison Woods voicing my displeasure on the situation and providing the background of the PCN issued. (Awaiting reply).
I may be missing out on further points of interest, I'll be re-reading YourParkingSpace T&C's in more detail later this evening.
Do I have any case here for my defence, should it come to court proceedings? Any advice would be greatly appreciated whilst I re-read the NEWBIE thread stickied.
0
Comments
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Issue date was the 21st October 2019.
It has been acknowledged per last night, however we have not yet filed a defence.0 -
Oh now this is something different! An interesting defence to write.
So you are neither the keeper nor the driver, yet you are the named DEFENDANT?!
You cannot be held liable for parking on private land unless you were the keeper, driver or hirer, and you were none of the above, and whatever twist the app puts on it is false and unlawful, just a word, nothing legal!- According to the YourParkingSpace Parking Contract, which I entered when making the booking (afraid I cannot attach links to my post apparently - easily found on the YourParkingSpace website however), I became "the driver" as per:
- Drivers. We refer in the Parking Contract to individuals who pay to park as Drivers, even if the person who pays to allow a vehicle to be parked in a parking space is not in fact the driver of that vehicle.PRIVATE 'PCN'? DON'T PAY BUT DON'T IGNORE IT (except N.Ireland).
CLICK at the top or bottom of any page where it says:
Home»Motoring»Parking Tickets Fines & Parking - read the NEWBIES THREAD0 -
With a Claim Issue Date of 21st October, and having filed the Acknowledgment of Service in a timely manner, you have until 4pm on Monday 25th November 2019 to file your Defence.Issue date was the 21st October 2019.
It has been acknowledged per last night, however we have not yet filed a defence.
That's nearly three weeks away. Plenty of time to produce a Defence, but please don't leave it to the last minute.
When you are happy with the content, your Defence could be filed via email as suggested here:-
Print your Defence.
- Sign it and date it.
- Scan the signed document back in and save it as a pdf.
- Send that pdf as an email attachment to CCBCAQ@Justice.gov.uk
- Just put the claim number and the word Defence in the email title, and in the body of the email something like 'Please find my Defence attached'.
- Log into MCOL after a few days to see if the Claim is marked "defence received". If not chase the CCBC until it is.
- Do not be surprised to receive an early copy of the Claimant's Directions Questionnaire, they are just trying to keep you under pressure.
- Wait for your DQ from the CCBC, or download one from the internet, and then re-read post #2 of the NEWBIES FAQ sticky thread to find out exactly what to do with it.
0 - Sign it and date it.
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Coupon-mad wrote: »Oh now this is something different! An interesting defence to write.
So you are neither the keeper nor the driver, yet you are the named DEFENDANT?!
You cannot be held liable for parking on private land unless you were the keeper, driver or hirer, and you were none of the above, and whatever twist the app puts on it is false and unlawful, just a word, nothing legal!
Apologies - I should have clarified this in the OP.
The claim is against my partner as it was her car nabbed by the ANPR. We were under the assumption that processing a change to the VRN within the YourParkingSpace app, would amend the details registered for the ANPR. Clearly this did not happen.0 -
Bumping this so the thread doesn't end up in the void.
Appreciate any further advice. Thank you.0 -
Yes, you need to write a defence.
Not difficult - you complied with the T&C and changed the booking to DEFENDANT VRM prior to arrival - I presume you have evidence of this. The defendants vehicle parked and, following the instructions on the Youpark... site took no further action, as they already had a contract to park.
PE are a stranger to this contract, as you already had confirmed, signed parking contract with the landholder using their agent... and so PE had absolutely NOTHING to offer you in any way shape or form
I would suggest counterclaiming. £500. Breach of DPA..0 -
[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]PE signs leave much to be desired. Many judges might find them insufficiently clear to form a contract, read these[/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/5972164/parking-eye-signs-oxford-road-reading[/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/5957364/first-parking-eye-appeal-unsuccessful[/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]
[/FONT] [FONT=Times New Roman, serif] [FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Nine times out of ten these tickets are scams, so consider complaining to your MP, it can cause the scammer extra costs and work.
Parliament is well aware of the MO of these private parking companies, many of whom are former clampers, and on 15th March 2019 a Bill was enacted to curb the excesses of these shysters. Codes of Practice are being drawn up, an independent appeals service will be set up, and access to the DVLA's date base more rigorously policed, persistent offenders denied access to the DVLA database and unable to operate.
Hopefully life will become impossible for the worst of these scammers, but until this is done you should still complain to your MP, citing the new legislation.
[/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2019/8/contents/enacted[/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]
Just as the clampers were finally closed down, so hopefully will many of these Private Parking Companies.[/FONT]
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[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]
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[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]
[/FONT]You never know how far you can go until you go too far.0 -
nosferatu1001 wrote: »Yes, you need to write a defence.
Not difficult - you complied with the T&C and changed the booking to DEFENDANT VRM prior to arrival - I presume you have evidence of this. The defendants vehicle parked and, following the instructions on the Youpark... site took no further action, as they already had a contract to park.
PE are a stranger to this contract, as you already had confirmed, signed parking contract with the landholder using their agent... and so PE had absolutely NOTHING to offer you in any way shape or form
I would suggest counterclaiming. £500. Breach of DPA..
Understood - defence will be written in due course - obviously not last minute. I do have evidence of the VRN changed to the DEFENDANTS vehicle.
The defendant in question is a trainee solicitor - can't wait for them to use their available options at their firm to help with the case, and send these scammers running with their tails between their legs.
Appreciate the further clarification, thanks.0 -
VRM. Not N. Its a mark not a number.0
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