eBay and Paypal scammed as a seller

System

MEM62 wrote: »

eBay has a set of rules. You signed up to these when you joined and sales/purchases are bound by them. Litigation is risky at the best of times but you are on a hiding to nothing if you sign up to a set of terms and conditions and then try to litigate because you decide that you don't like them at some later point. You have an additional complication in that eBay are a US company - where are you planning to serve your legal notice?

It is not that I am unsympathetic to your plight. I understand your frustration and I have had to fight eBay in respect of a purchase where I was defrauded by the seller so I have been where you are. You may be morally in the right but that is a long way from being successful in court.

At this stage eBay's ruling may still go your way so you don't know that you have lost out yet. How much are we talking about?

Well, you don't know what you are talking about.

Firstly,ebay UK is registered in England & Wales. The fact that it may be subsidiary of a US company is irreverent to the OP.

Secondly, standard T&Cs between a business and consumer require to be fair to both parties. Any elements which aren't - become unenforceable.

knightstyle

So send an envelope with something worthless in it to the scammer/buyer and get proof of purchase!!!!!!!!!

System

Well a proof of postage doesn't mean anything, as you can post anything and the buyer can still say it wasn't the item. There's no way around it.

System

There's no other way on eBay at least for me other than PayPal. They should not allow it if it's against their terms. But logically, you wouldn't want to accept cash on collection as it could be fake or you could get robbed.
I don't understand why some people expect me to be aware of scams and therefore it's my fault..?

pantaiema

soolin wrote: »

Proof of what exactly?

Am unknown person collecting an unknown item from an unknown address. neither ebay or paypal take photographic ID from users , so what exactly is being proved, especially since 'buyer' claims they were hacked.

Also as per the paypal payment emails they do warn about how to invoke seller protection, this is a cut and paste from a paypal payment I have just received:(the highlight is mine)

'This item is eligible for Seller Protection.
Don't forget to:

Send the item to the shipping address below within 7 days.
Please note:items delivered in person or to a different address are not cover by Seller Protection.
Use a trackable proof of delivery.

Proof that the item in question has been handed into the person. The fact that the 'buyer' claims they were hacked is not the OP business. Keep in mind it is eBay which allow collection in person in their system. It is higly likely that the scammer is the buyer himself. There are so many accounts on eBay. How coincedence it is his account was hacked at the same time he bought a high value item ?

The money has been moved to the OP account. The only way the ebay, PP, the buyer to get the money refunded is by suing the OP in the court.

I myself will not give up to the scammer for £1,000

General_Applause

Make sure you delete any link between your Paypal account and your bank account / credit card today. They will try and take any money you 'owe' them via these methods.


Paypal will appoint a toothless debt collector. Either ignore any letters or state that the debt is in dispute. Either way, nobody will take you to court over this.


The only possible downside is that you (or anyone they think is linked to you) will never be able to use Paypal again.

soolin

pantaiema wrote: »

Proof that the item in question has been handed into the person. The fact that the 'buyer' claims they were hacked is not the OP business. Keep in mind it is eBay which allow collection in person in their system. It is higly likely that the scammer is the buyer himself. There are so many accounts on eBay. How coincedence it is his account was hacked at the same time he bought a high value item ?

The money has been moved to the OP account. The only way the ebay, PP, the buyer to get the money refunded is by suing the OP in the court.

I myself will not give up to the scammer for £1,000

Which person? Who should collect it and what 'proof' do you think paypal require from a person before they are allowed to collect and how is that 'proof' obtained.

soolin

sok777 wrote: »

There's no other way on eBay at least for me other than PayPal. They should not allow it if it's against their terms. But logically, you wouldn't want to accept cash on collection as it could be fake or you could get robbed.
I don't understand why some people expect me to be aware of scams and therefore it's my fault..?

The fact that it is on the email that paypal sent you, and due to the amount you were accepting perhaps?

If you are not expected to know how things work and take no effort to protect yourself, who should be taking that responsibility?

soolin

with apologies I have merged these two threads now, so it might look a bit messy, sorry OP.

System

I completely disagree with you. And it's not just because I think you're blaming the victim.
You can't expect ordinary genuine people to be aware of scams. PayPal and their so called protection is a joke to be honest because a proof of delivery is absolutely worthless as the buyer can claim that someone else signed for them or that it was a different item. That's like giving warranty that doesn't cover anything in real life.
But either way, that's not the point. The point is that even if the buyer's account was hacked, I shouldn't be made responsible for that. I have sold the item to the buyer and the collection was arranged directly on eBay, messaging the buyer. This, in court I hope, would serve as a much better evidence. If this guy's account was hacked then really either eBay or him is responsible for bad security. We can agree to disagree, but I hope you'll at least acknowledge that an attitude that implies that the victim deserves it is never the right one. Thank you for your points and references and time taken to respond.