Brexit the economy and house prices part 7: Brexit Harder

Thrugelmir

Let's throw some mud............

Corbyn told Neil: ‘I didn’t support the IRA. I don’t support the IRA. What I want everywhere is a peace process.’ This is a lie. Corbyn opposed the Anglo-Irish agreement. He reportedly lobbied the government on behalf of IRA prisoners. A socialist magazine whose editorial board he headed gloated over the Brighton bombing and threatened Margaret Thatcher with further violence.

Corbyn told Neil: ‘I never met the IRA.’ This is a lie. Corbyn invited Gerry Adams to the Commons weeks after the Brighton bombing. Ireland’s Taoiseach Enda Kenny has said that, from all the evidence he has seen, Adams was not merely an IRA member but sat on its army council. According to a Daily Telegraph investigation, Corbyn shared a platform at a 1994 rally with Angelo Fusco, an IRA terrorist on the run after shooting dead an SAS officer.

Corbyn told Neil: ‘My role was supporting a process which would bring about a dialogue and I believe you have to talk.’ This is a lie. The SDLP’s Seamus Mallon, former deputy first minister of Northern Ireland and one of the architects of the peace process, says: ‘I never heard anyone mention Corbyn at all. He very clearly took the side of the IRA and that was incompatible, in my opinion, with working for peace.’ Ex-IRA terrorist Sean O’Callaghan says Corbyn ‘played no part ever, at any time, in promoting peace in Northern Ireland’ and any suggestion otherwise is ‘a cowardly, self-serving lie’.

phillw

Thrugelmir wrote: »

Let's throw some mud............

What is one more after all the fantasy mud that Leave supporters have thrown, it would be nice if you could actually come up with something honest.

Mr Adams has always maintained he was never in the IRA.

How would anyone who met Mr Adams know that they'd met someone from the IRA, if they claimed they were not in the IRA?

https://www.channel4.com/news/factcheck/factcheck-corbyn-on-northern-ireland

It is now known that the British government maintained contact to the IRA leadership through a secret back channel for much of this period too.

Corbyn voted against it and spoke against it in parliament, saying: “We believe that the agreement strengthens rather than weakens the border between the six and the 26 counties, and those of us who wish to see a United Ireland oppose the agreement for that reason.”

Sailtheworld

Dee_Best wrote: »

Because no he wasn't, he was sacked for not being open about a (private) affair.

That sounds a bit like lying.

Dee_Best wrote: »

If we're going to play the fairness card we could ask why wasn't Corbyn sacked for his affair with Diane Abbott?

It's not a fairness card - it's the 'but Jeremy Corbyn' card played when anyone says anything bad about a Tory.

phillw

Dee_Best wrote: »

Proof of that please saying that Boris lied?

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/boris-johnson-lies-conservative-leader-candidate-list-times-banana-brexit-bus-a8929076.html

Boris Johnson was sacked from his job at The Times newspaper over allegations he fabricated a quote from his godfather, the historian Colin Lucas, for a front-page article about the discovery of Edward II’s Rose Palace. “The trouble was that somewhere in my copy I managed to attribute to Colin the view that Edward II and Piers Gaveston would have been cavorting together in the Rose Palace,” he claimed.

Alas, Gaveston was executed 13 years before the palace was built. “It was very nasty,” Mr Johnson added, before attempting to downplay it as nothing more than a schoolboy blunder.


After leaving the Times, Mr Johnson moved to The Daily Telegraph, working as the publication's Brussels correspondent between 1989 and 1994.

His articles, like those in several other Eurosceptic newspapers, contained many of the claims widely described as “Euromyths”, including plans to introduce same-size “eurocoffins”, establish a “banana police force” to regulate the shape of the curved yellow fruit, and ban prawn cocktail crisps.

When questioned about them in parliament, he denied suggestions they were a figment of his imagination.

“There is a great deal of effort being made to deprecate those who think we should leave the EU and everything we say is somehow mythical”, he replied.


Michael Howard gave Boris Johnson two new jobs after becoming leader of the Conservatives in 2003 – party vice-chairman and shadow arts minister.

He was sacked from both positions in November 2004 after assuring Mr Howard that tabloid reports of his affair with Spectator columnist Petronella Wyatt were false and an “inverted pyramid of piffle”. When the story was found to be true, he refused to resign.


In January Boris Johnson claimed he did not mention Turkey during the referendum after it was suggested he falsely claimed 80 million Turks would come to Britain unless the UK left the EU.

In fact, he co-signed a letter stating that “the only way to avoid having common borders with Turkey is to vote Leave and take back control”. The Vote Leave campaign also produced a poster reading: “Turkey (population 76 million) is joining the EU”, adding “David Cameron wants Turkey to join the EU. How will our NHS cope?”.

Dee_Best wrote: »

If we're going to play the fairness card we could ask why wasn't Corbyn sacked for his affair with Diane Abbott?

Did the affair end up in the papers? Did he then lie about it? Boris assumed he'd get sacked for admitting the affair, so he lied. He therefore had to be sacked.

You also have to accept that if you're a right wing MP in a right wing party, then you're likely to be treated differently than a lib dem in a lib dem party or left wing in a left wing party. If you don't like being treated the way you treat others, then maybe you would choose a different party & treat people better

Dee_Best

Sailtheworld wrote: »

That sounds a bit like lying.

So everybody who is quiet or saying nothing is at that moment lying "a bit"?

Sailtheworld wrote: »

It's not a fairness card - it's the 'but Jeremy Corbyn' card played when anyone says anything bad about a Tory.

Real meaning: "No I can't answer why that is so I will resort to trusty old deflection instead".

Dee_Best

phillw wrote: »

Boris Johnson was sacked from his job at The Times newspaper
....

You are quoting the wrong example first.
You're supposed to find where Michael Howard actually said Boris lied, remember?
Sheesh it's only a few posts ago.
So I'm still waiting because you have not supplied a quote from Michael Howard saying Johnson lied.

phillw

Dee_Best wrote: »

So everybody who is quiet or saying nothing is at that moment lying "a bit"?

He didn't keep quiet about it, he lied about it.

Dee_Best wrote: »

So I'm still waiting because you have not supplied a quote from Michael Howard saying Johnson lied.

Wow, you're so entitled. I did actually post about that, but you didn't even bother to read it.

I'll post some more, I assume you won't accept it because it would hurt your argument.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/1476560/Howard-sacks-devastated-Boris-Johnson-over-affair.html

Mr Howard's officials said the issue was one of "personal morality". They suggested that Mr Johnson had been less than frank with the Tory leader when newspaper stories about his allegedly having had an affair with Petronella Wyatt, a fellow Spectator journalist, broke last weekend.

Mr Howard's spokesman said last night: "In view of the fresh allegations made against Boris Johnson, Michael Howard has relieved him of his responsibilities as shadow minister for the arts and vice-chairman of the Conservative Party."

Officials close to Mr Howard said that the Tory leader had stood "emphatically" by Mr Johnson when the allegations - which the MP had dismissed as an "inverted pyramid of piffle" - first broke.

It was only after Mr Johnson failed to give a fuller picture about his friendship with Ms Wyatt, a columnist on The Spectator, that Mr Howard's position changed, they said.

He lied, then when the lie was revealed then he refused to admit that he'd lied. Which is kinda how he has operated ever since to this day. You seem to have learned from him.

Dee_Best

phillw wrote: »

He didn't keep quiet about it, he lied about it.

Ahem.
From further on in your post:

phillw wrote: »

It was only after Mr Johnson failed to give a fuller picture about ....

That's clear enough, he did keep quiet about it.
Thank you for clarifying that yourself even if it was unintentional.
:T

Sailtheworld

Dee_Best wrote: »

So everybody who is quiet or saying nothing is at that moment lying "a bit"?

If he refuted the affair by saying 'it was an inverted pyramid of piffle' then he lied.

He had other options available, He could've told the truth or he could've told Howard to mind his own business. It's not the fact of the affair that's important (although if his wives, girlfriends, brother & colleagues don't trust him I'm not sure why I should) but the fact that he defaulted to lies when other options were available.

Dee_Best wrote: »

Real meaning: "No I can't answer why that is so I will resort to trusty old deflection instead".

No, mentioning Corbyn (thinking somehow that if I think Boris is a t*t I must therefore love Corbyn) is the deflection.

phillw

Sailtheworld wrote: »

but the fact that he defaulted to lies when other options were available.

When you meet people who live their lives "Why tell the truth when there is a perfectly good lie?" then you should get away as quickly as possible.

Some conservative MPs have done that already.