If there is a second referendum ...

adindas

If there was referendum, the referendum should ask whether to invade Ireland.


Remoaners, Teresa May should be blamed for all Brexit mess us.

MisterMotivated

MobileSaver wrote: »

If enough people care sufficiently about the subject then yes we keep voting; a bit like we don't just have one General Election vote and that result stands forever...

... or do you think that because the British people voted for a Conservative government in 2017 then that should be the end of the matter and the Conservatives should remain in power for evermore?

Except Brexit isn't something that can be organised in a matter of weeks, and we haven't even given the public time to decide whether it was a success or not. I was voted into the EU 40 years ago (to quote Badgerhead, my parents were probably told "your kids are gonna love it"). These people - and many others - have realised what a mistake it was and we have finally managed to get out again. It's only fair that Brexit is given time to be judged on its success or failure.



When a party wins a general election, they take power immediately. After several years of government we can see how they've performed and decide if we want more of the same or a change; we haven't even left the EU yet so how can we possibly judge whether the UK has done better/worse outside the EU?



There will always be people disagreeing with the result whatever it is, but having vote after vote on such a lengthy process without giving time for implementation is an exercise in futility.



Scenario 1:

• We have another vote, which Remain wins and we stay in the EU
• Due to the uproar from Brexiteers, another referendum is called, which Leave wins and we start preparations for Brexit 2: Brexit Harder
• During the preparations, Remainers campaign for another referendum, which they win. Brexit 2 is cancelled
• Brexiteers complain of voting irregularities and ANOTHER referendum is called, which they win and prepare for Brexit 3: Brexit with a Vengeance.
• And so on
• And so on

Scenario 2:

• We leave the EU
• Remainers continue their demands for another referendum, citing terrible roaming charges as a result of Brexit
• We have a vote, Remain wins and we prepare to rejoin the EU
• During the preparations for Bre-entry, Brexiteers complain that the EU forcing us to join the Euro is unacceptable and demand another referendum, which they win. Bre-entry is cancelled
• Remain campaigners, upset at not being able to just nip across the channel for cheap booze, call for another referendum, which they win.
• Preparations begin for Bre-unification
• Angry that the UK is now forced to choose between speaking one of only two official EU languages - French or German - call for another referendum which they win
• Bre-unification is cancelled.
• And so on
• And so on

MobileSaver

MisterMotivated wrote: »

Except Brexit isn't something that can be organised in a matter of weeks, and we haven't even given the public time to decide whether it was a success or not.

• And so on
• And so on

I totally get all of that but none of it changes the falsehood repeated ad nauseam by you and others that another referendum would be undemocratic.

A referendum is, by definition, democratic. It really is that simple and the continuing defence of the indefensible makes you all look more and more desperate by the day. Why are you all so afraid of asking the British people what they want to do now that we've had two and a half years of debate and coverage on the subject?

wunferall

MobileSaver wrote: »

I totally get all of that but none of it changes the falsehood repeated ad nauseam by you and others that another referendum would be undemocratic.

A referendum is, by definition, democratic. It really is that simple and the continuing defence of the indefensible makes you all look more and more desperate by the day. Why are you all so afraid of asking the British people what they want to do now that we've had two and a half years of debate and coverage on the subject?

A referendum is indeed by definition democratic if the result of said referendum is respected.

We were told were we not that the result of the EU referendum would be respected?
Has it been, yet?
Not until March 29th at 23:00 hrs. it hasn't.

So if you are truly so concerned about respecting democracy, why is it that you cannot abide by a democratically-made decision and do what would be democratically correct, i.e. arrange a vote after leaving the EU asking if the British public would like to rejoin?

I suspect that the reason you do not agree with such a democratic way to honour the only vote held so far (recently of course) is because you know exactly what the probable outcome would be.
And you still don't like your chances.


So we know very well exactly who looks desperate.
Remainers insisting that another referendum is needed, just because they didn't like the answer the first time around.
Well, these people should have objected before the referendum.
Now is too late.

The falsehood is remainers like yourself saying they believe in democracy whilst at the same time doing all they can to deny it happening, and that is just sour grapes.

wunferall

LHW99 wrote: »

Nice in theory, but I think if we remained in the EU and tried that approach it would be stamped on pretty quick.

Remainers please note that European Parliament elections are held every five years.
The European Commission do not see it as necessary to hold elections for MEP's any sooner than every five years although undoubtedly many voters will have changed their minds or altered their stance in the intervening period.
Does that make the EU undemocratic?


What do you think (remainers, seriously if you can please) the EU would say to the uncertainty of regular "We're in" or "We're out" -style referendums from any member state?

kabayiri

I've noticed a change in tone on the radio recently, using the words 'managed no deal'.

We are already stockpiling medicines, and prep for additional ferries etc will only increase.

It should have started 6 months earlier IMO, but at least there is progress now.

Offering a re-entry referendum should be linked to a GE, so that the parties can actually align their policy *before* consulting the public this time.

Herzlos

LHW99 wrote: »

You manage to avoid the flights filled with stag / hen parties that started the celebrations well before boarding then?

Apparently so. But presumably they are all going to Prague, Budapest or Magaluf these days?

MisterMotivated

MobileSaver wrote: »

I totally get all of that but none of it changes the falsehood repeated ad nauseam by you and others that another referendum would be undemocratic.

A referendum is, by definition, democratic. It really is that simple and the continuing defence of the indefensible makes you all look more and more desperate by the day. Why are you all so afraid of asking the British people what they want to do now that we've had two and a half years of debate and coverage on the subject?

I voted in a democratic referendum. I voted Leave as did the majority of voters who took part. You now want to render that DEMOCRATIC vote UTTERLY MEANINGLESS by suggesting we vote again without honouring the result of the first vote. Quite frankly, it makes a mockery of democracy.

lisyloo

kabayiri wrote: »

I've noticed a change in tone on the radio recently, using the words 'managed no deal'.

We are already stockpiling medicines, and prep for additional ferries etc will only increase.

It should have started 6 months earlier IMO, but at least there is progress now.

Offering a re-entry referendum should be linked to a GE, so that the parties can actually align their policy *before* consulting the public this time.

Hmm......so we have a harbour at Ramsgate that can’t take big ships and needs repairs, a ferry company with no ships and takeaway firm terms and conditions..................yep sound like it’s all going pretty well

badmemory

I have to wonder what is democratic about a leader lying about the reasons for "things" going wrong for people. That is, Cameron blaming the EU for everything. Then after those mammoth lies, holding a referendum, then acting surprised when people voted out. I have to wonder how many people didn't actually bother voting because remain was so obvious an answer.


I am sure those on here will be delighted to know that my vote has changed from remain to a no deal exit. As in if we are stuck with coming out then we should actually come out, after all that is what the exit vote meant. The good news will be that those skyrocket London house prices will come tumbling down - for the rest of us it will just be here we go again & hopefully one of a couple will stay in work.