If there is a second referendum ...

Herzlos

Takedap wrote: »

The problem is that it's already too late. The Genie is out of the bottle. If we go back now, the Remainers will always insist that we would have been better off if we had left. And the EU would know that they do not need to keep giving us special treatment, ie, no single currency, no payment rebates etc.

The Genie is out of the bottle whatever happens.


If we remain, the leavers will feel robbed, and will push to leave again.


If we leave, the remainers will feel robber, and will push to rejoin.
If we get the wrong kind of leave, the leavers will also feel robbed.
If we get the right kind of leave, and any of "Project Fear" becomes too, the leavers will feel robbed.


I don't think the EU would be giving us any new special treatment anyway, but I don't think they'd be able to remove any existing special treatment; currency, Shengen.

Le73Uq86Uv

Not until this one has been activated for quite some time.

Takedap

Herzlos wrote: »

The Genie is out of the bottle whatever happens.


If we remain, the leavers will feel robbed, and will push to leave again.


If we leave, the remainers will feel robber, and will push to rejoin.
If we get the wrong kind of leave, the leavers will also feel robbed.
If we get the right kind of leave, and any of "Project Fear" becomes too, the leavers will feel robbed.


I don't think the EU would be giving us any new special treatment anyway, but I don't think they'd be able to remove any existing special treatment; currency, Shengen.

Leaving means never being able to go back. At least not on the very preferential terms we have now.

PhilE

Rejoining after leaving may be less likely. If the UK has an economic crash we will be in a weaker position to negotiate on anything, with less to offer.

Rejoining would mean the EU having to bail us out, as they did for Greece. And then what's to stop the UK from once again sulking, once they have recovered.

Our politicians are embarrassingly stupid, the populace can't be trusted to make a rational decision. What would we have to offer the EU or anyone, should we have an economic crash?

Leave means we are susceptible to an economic crash, and will be completely alone should it happen.

Herzlos

I think that's why the leavers are so keen for us to leave before asking the public if we really want to leave - it'll be harder to do and the EU could always tell us no. The irony being a peoples vote would make a hard brexit more likely, if that's genuinely the will of the people.

Takedap wrote: »

Leaving means never being able to go back. At least not on the very preferential terms we have now.

Absolutely. But once we leave the terms we had now are off the table for good, and it'll be a case of determining which is better out of (a) whatever Brexit turns out to be or (b) what new membership of the EU looks like. (b) is almost certainly better, thus will be the preferential option by easily 75% of the electorate (all of the remainers and half of the leavers).

kabayiri

We just don't know what direction the EU will take if we left.

I've heard people familiar with the activity in the EU parliament, talking about how the UK often acted as a counterbalance in negotiations between EU states.

If it suited the EU to have the UK re-enter, the welcome mat could indeed come out.

Moe_The_Bartender

PhilE wrote: »

Rejoining after leaving may be less likely. If the UK has an economic crash we will be in a weaker position to negotiate on anything, with less to offer.

Rejoining would mean the EU having to bail us out, as they did for Greece. And then what's to stop the UK from once again sulking, once they have recovered.

Our politicians are embarrassingly stupid, the populace can't be trusted to make a rational decision. What would we have to offer the EU or anyone, should we have an economic crash?

Leave means we are susceptible to an economic crash, and will be completely alone should it happen.

It's every bit as likely that the EU will have an economic crash. The Eurozone is heading into recession and the ECB has no weapons in its armoury to do anything about it. Reduce interest rates? Nope. More QE. Nope.

And the EU didn't bail out Greece. They handed the money directly to the French and German banks which had stupidly lent money that they deserved to lose. The money was added to Greece's debts and repayment extended for 50 years or so. Not one penny of Greece's debt has been forgiven.

Lungboy

No Deal scuppered?

PhilE

Yes mate, the EU are having a crash. Look, Mercedes just went bankrupt. And the East Europeans got deported. And the NHS has been saved. Britain is pure Anglo Saxon again. The Empire has risen. England wins the world cup.

This is the mental landscape of a Brexiter. Completely in la la land. Laughing stock of the civilized world.

Takedap

Herzlos wrote: »

Absolutely. But once we leave the terms we had now are off the table for good, and it'll be a case of determining which is better out of (a) whatever Brexit turns out to be or (b) what new membership of the EU looks like. (b) is almost certainly better, thus will be the preferential option by easily 75% of the electorate (all of the remainers and half of the leavers).

Although even as an ardent Remainer, I would probably think again if the terms of rejoining meant that we would have to adopt the Euro & accept being part of the Schengen area.