25 Brexit need-to-knows

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  • One-Eye
    One-Eye Posts: 66,712 Forumite
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    1) UK has already agreed that EU airlines can continue to fly to UK with no disruption.
    2) EASA has already accepted that existing UK Air Operator Certificates will be valid for at least 9 months following a no deal Brexit (ie. no disruption to existing flights)
    3) EASA recognises the CAA as a valid authority and is already accepting applications for new Third Country Operators for UK operators authorised by the CAA. Providing these are applied for correctly and paid for by 15/03 then they will come into operation on 30/03. (ie. no disruption to new flights)
    4) The UK has already concluded replacement Open Skies agreements with nine countries covered by EU Open Skies agreements, including a deal with USA and Canada which is potentially better than the EU agreement (ie. no disruption to flights to non-EU countries)

    Tim Alderslade, chief executive of Airlines UK, the industry association that represents 13 UK carriers, said: "Flights will continue between the UK and EU even in the event of a no-deal Brexit, as we have always said."

    Airport Operators Association chief executive Karen Dee said "Travellers looking to book their 2019 holidays, family visits and business trips can rest assured that there will be no disruption to their flights in a no-deal Brexit scenario."
  • lisyloo
    lisyloo Posts: 29,638 Forumite
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    Doc_N wrote: »
    Long queues at every port leaving and returning to the ship because cruisers have to queue up with everyone else to have their passports checked?


    People already cruise to places outside of the EU.


    If the ports/countries in question want the business (and there's a fair change they do) then they will put arrangements in place.
    This might be getting VISAs in advance or a representative from the Port Authority coming on board to check through the passports.


    They might be willing to delegate some of checks.
    For example I went to St Petersburg on a cruise and they had different (easier) arrangements for people who were on an excursion organised by the cruise operator rather than those travelling independently.


    I don't recall this being an issue anywhere I've cruised.


    The only time I had an issue was at US immigration when I flew in but returned from Canada. It took a while but it finally dawned on my that they were concerned that I had no return flight booked from the US.


    Where's there is big money involved I'm confident that arrangements will be made to smooth the way.
  • Doc_N
    Doc_N Posts: 8,292 Forumite
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    lisyloo wrote: »
    People already cruise to places outside of the EU.

    If the ports/countries in question want the business (and there's a fair change they do) then they will put arrangements in place.
    This might be getting VISAs in advance or a representative from the Port Authority coming on board to check through the passports.

    They might be willing to delegate some of checks.
    For example I went to St Petersburg on a cruise and they had different (easier) arrangements for people who were on an excursion organised by the cruise operator rather than those travelling independently.

    I don't recall this being an issue anywhere I've cruised.

    The only time I had an issue was at US immigration when I flew in but returned from Canada. It took a while but it finally dawned on my that they were concerned that I had no return flight booked from the US.

    Where's there is big money involved I'm confident that arrangements will be made to smooth the way.

    I think you're being overoptimistic. It won't have been an issue before because as members of the EU we had agreements in place which enabled passport checks in most countries to be replaced by a simple swipe of a ship's card.

    That will disappear overnight on 29 March if there's no deal, and since cruise passengers spend very little (even going back to the ship for lunch in many cases) nobody's going to care too much about it.

    The only real damage will be to British cruise passengers (no international agreements in place after 29 March) and cruise companies sailing from Britain.
  • waamo
    waamo Posts: 10,298 Forumite
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    Doc_N wrote: »
    I think you're being overoptimistic. It won't have been an issue before because as members of the EU we had agreements in place which enabled passport checks in most countries to be replaced by a simple swipe of a ship's card.

    That will disappear overnight on 29 March if there's no deal, and since cruise passengers spend very little (even going back to the ship for lunch in many cases) nobody's going to care too much about it.

    The only real damage will be to British cruise passengers (no international agreements in place after 29 March) and cruise companies sailing from Britain.

    I think you are being over pessimistic. Cruise companies are stating there will be no change and the U.K. government has put in place agreements to ensure the present arrangements continue.

    https://www.pocruises.com/brexit/?ef_id=eaiaiqobc!!!!47himow4aivjtbtch2ksqiaeaayasaaegkt1fd_bwe:g:s&gclid=EAIaIQobC!!!!47HiMOW4AIVJTbTCh2KSQIAEAAYASAAEgKt1fD_BwE
  • Doc_N
    Doc_N Posts: 8,292 Forumite
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    waamo wrote: »
    I think you are being over pessimistic. Cruise companies are stating there will be no change and the U.K. government has put in place agreements to ensure the present arrangements continue.

    https://www.pocruises.com/brexit/?ef_id=eaiaiqobc!!!!47himow4aivjtbtch2ksqiaeaayasaaegkt1fd_bwe:g:s&gclid=EAIaIQobC!!!!47HiMOW4AIVJTbTCh2KSQIAEAAYASAAEgKt1fD_BwE

    Sorry, but you're misinterpreting what the cruise companies are actually saying - they're issuing bland statements which actually say nothing at all, and there are no agreements in place to cover this situation in the even of a no deal Brexit.

    If you have anything specific on this, though, I'd be delighted to see it.
  • waamo
    waamo Posts: 10,298 Forumite
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    Doc_N wrote: »
    Sorry, but you're misinterpreting what the cruise companies are actually saying - they're issuing bland statements which actually say nothing at all, and there are no agreements in place to cover this situation in the even of a no deal Brexit.

    If you have anything specific on this, though, I'd be delighted to see it.

    The U.K. government https://www.gov.uk/guidance/passenger-travel-to-the-eu-by-air-rail-or-sea-after-brexit#travelling-by-sea-to-the-eu-from-the-uk

    Passengers should not experience any difference. I'm not sure how much clearer it could be.
  • leylandsunaddict
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    The EU drew up a proposed Regulation governing no deal flights last December. It's not been passed as yet, as far as I know.

    Yes, flights will continue, but the proposal is setting the flight levels the same as in 2018, for both Summer and Winter IATA seasons. Obviously airlines will have increased flights on some routes, and some will have added new routes. In that case, some flights would have to be cancelled. Simon Calder covered it briefly in the Independent last December.
  • Doc_N
    Doc_N Posts: 8,292 Forumite
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    waamo wrote: »
    The U.K. government https://www.gov.uk/guidance/passenger-travel-to-the-eu-by-air-rail-or-sea-after-brexit#travelling-by-sea-to-the-eu-from-the-uk

    Passengers should not experience any difference. I'm not sure how much clearer it could be.

    I'm well aware of that 'guidance' reproduced below and it's not remotely clear if you understand how cruising operates within the rules of international treaties:

    Cruising

    From 29 March 2019, if there is no EU Exit deal, cruise operations will continue on the same basis as today. Passengers who embark on a cruise at a UK port will continue to be protected by the EU regulation on maritime passengers’ rights, which will be brought into UK law.

    Passengers should take out appropriate travel insurance, check and understand the terms and conditions of their booking, and check with their cruise line and insurance provider if they have any questions.

    Before you leave for your cruise, check online for the latest travel information and information from your cruise operator.


    It's delightfully vague, with sweeping generalisations, and makes no mention whatever of the real problem - going ashore at the various ports visited. At present there's a simple ship's card system - you're swiped in and out of the ship with your card, no passports needed. The system depends on international treaties and agreements we currently have by virtue of our EU membership. When that goes, the agreements go with it, and it's going to passports only (and within Europe we'll be non-EU members subject to further checks).

    Passport checking is a much more time consuming system than the 5 seconds taken to swipe a card by the staff on a ship. It's likely to lead to long queues getting into ports, and getting back to the ship again.
  • phillw
    phillw Posts: 5,595 Forumite
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    edited 17 March 2019 at 1:17PM
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    Doc_N wrote: »
    When that goes, the agreements go with it, and it's going to passports only (and within Europe we'll be non-EU members subject to further checks).

    They must already deal with EU citizens and non EU citizens, the difference is we're just moving from one group to the other. How do they handle it already?

    Time and cost will change of course, we all knew the extra red tape and costs that leaving the EU would bring.
  • Doc_N
    Doc_N Posts: 8,292 Forumite
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    phillw wrote: »
    They must already deal with EU citizens and non EU citizens, the difference is we're just moving from one group to the other.

    How do they handle it already?

    Not as simple as that. We’re not just becoming non-EU citizens like all the others. We’re becoming non-EU citizens of a state which hasn’t been able to negotiate all the international treaties required to allow the present straightforward system to continue.
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