Brexit discussions

Tabbytabitha

Wild_Rover wrote: »

Of course people have feelings, but peoples' feelings are their own, and feelings can only be hurt if their owners allow them to be.

Pandering to folk who don't like their views being criticised in a forceful way is rewarding childish behaviour.

Freedom of speech is far more important than an individual's feelings.

WR

Your earlier post wasn't talking about criticising a person's views but about personal comments - don't you see any difference between the two?

Where do you see freedom of speech sitting if people make racist or sexist remarks? (Or similar)

Jackmydad

Maybe I'm not easily offended, but what I've seen on the Brexit thread seems to me more along the lines of lively debate with the odd jibe both ways.
Seems OK for the House of Commons?
If you want to have a real discussion about anything, then it's perhaps reasonable to expect other opinion but your own. And expect it to be quite strongly delivered in some cases.

[Deleted User]

Tabbytabitha wrote: »

Your earlier post wasn't talking about criticising a person's views but about personal comments - don't you see any difference between the two?

Where do you see freedom of speech sitting if people make racist or sexist remarks? (Or similar)

If I think someone is an idiot for expressing an opinion, I will say so. Everyone has an opinion on at least some thing or other. If I think that some opinion or approach is unsubstantiated or wrong, if I can be bothered, I'll say so, and yes, if I think I am justified in doing so, I will ask pointed questions and perhaps even take the p!ss.

If someone says something racist or sexist, I too will call them out on it, if I want. Have I been sexist or racist? I don't consider myself to be sexist or racist, and if you can, point out to me where you think I have been. The trouble is, what is sexist or racist is a matter of opinion.

Even then, so what if I, or you, or anyone else calls someone a "name"?

For what it's worth, to me, freedom of speech IS more important than the risk of causing "offence". The more you give other people the right to tell you what you can or can't say, the more you give your freedom away. You can willingly give that freedom away if you like. Don't expect me to do it as well.

There's enough fascism around already. We don't need to encourage more thought police into being, and if that statement offends those who want more thought police, tough!

WR

always_sunny

When people become rude and have direct goes at someone is easier to put them on ignore than reporting them, banning the whole topic is a bit silly given that it'll run for few years anyway so it'll just move somewhere else using some sort of codes.

Brexit will impact so many aspects of the country that banning would be almost impossible.

Filo25

I actually post on there and I wouldn't be bothered if it was locked to be honest (eqully not to bothered if its left open), just a lot of people choosing sides and preaching to the choir with little evidence of either side listening to the other.

While I do think its a hugely important issue and it should be sensibly discussed in an adult manner by both sides, we seem to have moved beyond being capable of that, sadly, I can't say that its a thread that is adding a great deal to human understanding on the issue!

WillimS

MSE_Andrea wrote: »

Yes it is. Sadly we may have to if people can't discuss it in an adult manner without arguing and making personal comments towards other forum members.

If anyone reports a post/thread simply because they disagree with the content you should put a ban on them for wasting time, there's no need to punish everyone who debates respectfully due to a few who report others because they disagree with them.

simonineaston

Trouble is, it's all very well talking about Brexit, but since nobody (including, it seems, the members of Her Majesty's Government!) can do anything useful about it, it's perhaps not surprising we can sometimes get a bit antsy about the topic!

tommix

Tbh I am totally offended by all tories and brexiteers but I wouldn't want any of 'em banned..My role on this site is to help them see the light and hopefully convert them to the joys of socialism. Whilst I appreciate my views being validated by those who agree with me, there is no challenge in preaching to the converted.

Those who disagree with me can call me what they like, as they often do, fortunately I am not a snowflake that melts easily.

However I appreciate that some people can get hurt by cruel comments. Those who make blatantly cruel and offensive statements to individual posters should not be tolerated and should quite rightly be banned immediately!

These posters are not welcome by me or anybody else, but they are generally blatant trolls and are easy to spot and deal with.

I am not convinced that closing down threads as a consequence of 'heated argument' or whatever, is the way forward.:cool:

Sapphire

Would it not be possible to include an 'ignore' button at the bottom of the posts (I believe some sites have that)? That way, if anyone doesn't like a poster's comments, they could easily click on to 'ignore' and not see their posts. I think that would be far better than banning free speech, and it would solve the issue presented here.

Former_MSE_Andrea

Thank you for your comments folks.

To answer the ones I can right now:

* No-one should be calling anyone else an idiot on this Forum. Being friendly to other MoneySavers is a core part of the rules all forum members agreed to when they joined. If anyone wants to do that please do it on a different website, not here.

* Please add anyone you don't get on with to your ignore list in the same way you might block someone on other social media. If you feel they've broken our rules please report the post first.

* Sadly we do sometimes have to take action on "repeat offenders" who use the report button maliciously. We'd much rather spend our time helping you all save money.

Please help us keep the forum friendly.

Pleasant debate is fine. Rudeness is not.