Smart Meters

[Deleted User]

EachPenny wrote: »

Not yet, but the infrastructure being installed now could be used as a stepping stone on the way to doing just that.

The first barrier to having remote monitoring of individual appliance use is having the communications network to transfer the data. Once that communications network is established you are well on the way to achieving what the OP proposes.

But overall I agree with you, the Government's preferred option will be to increase per-vehicle road tax possibly with a usage element based on annual miles driven. The latter is more likely to be implemented through a 'black box' solution that becomes compulsory on vehicles manufactured after a certain date.

Lift the bonnet on most modern cars and if you knew what you were looking for you'll find most of the technology required is already in them.

British Gas have already pioneered a smart meter only Time of Use tariff over 3 years ago which has been fairly popular.This is the free 8 hrs electricity on either Saturday or Sunday.. This tariff can only be used with smart meters for people on single rate meters. It is a TOU tariff. This tariff does not need the DCC to be involved.
Each supplier can run this as they see fit.Only BG have had a go at it so far, but this is typical of BG to be ahead of the slovenly rest of UK suppliers
Other than that BG free 8 hour tariff, Time of Use tariffs have been in use for decades in Eco 7 and Eco 10 dumb meters. They are nothing to be feared and many swear by them even without Night Storage Heaters.
I have heard about the Police in Italy logging into the cars ECU (under the dashboard ) to determine top speed etc in accidents , but I would have thought every car with a built in Sat Nav has that capability also in its recording data

jcontest

It will never be per-appliance. The simple reason is that even if they wanted to do it, it would probably take them so long to implement it that no business would really care about it. If it will not start making money in 5 years then it's just not going to happen.


On a side note and back to lekky cars, many installed car charging points that I know about are connected via 2g/3g to give that data back for the DNO if they want to use it. It doesn't mean all future charging points will be that way, but I know the kit I had, and that others received at that time, all uploaded usage data.


As for TOU Tariffs. They are something I fear. Not because of what they are but because of how they will be applied. Marketing bods will say things like "98% of the day your electricity is free", but 2% of the day during peak power usage you pay 20* the rate.

If all of the energy companies pick different TOU slots then it would make comparing really difficult too. To come close to getting a good comparison you would be forced to open up your whole usage chart to compare sites. As it stands now, you "as a end user" can't download the data locally. Data has to be sent to your supplier who can then provide it to you. DCC is in the middle of that now, so you can be sure once they are able ot outsource this to comparison sites that they will. Economy7 and Economy10 were fairly uniform across the country. Economy 11-5,9-10,1-2:30 tariff will boggle peoples mind.

System

jcontest wrote: »

It will never be per-appliance. The simple reason is that even if they wanted to do it, it would probably take them so long to implement it that no business would really care about it. If it will not start making money in 5 years then it's just not going to happen.


On a side note and back to lekky cars, many installed car charging points that I know about are connected via 2g/3g to give that data back for the DNO if they want to use it. It doesn't mean all future charging points will be that way, but I know the kit I had, and that others received at that time, all uploaded usage data.


As for TOU Tariffs. They are something I fear. Not because of what they are but because of how they will be applied. Marketing bods will say things like "98% of the day your electricity is free", but 2% of the day during peak power usage you pay 20* the rate.

If all of the energy companies pick different TOU slots then it would make comparing really difficult too. To come close to getting a good comparison you would be forced to open up your whole usage chart to compare sites. As it stands now, you "as a end user" can't download the data locally. Data has to be sent to your supplier who can then provide it to you. DCC is in the middle of that now, so you can be sure once they are able ot outsource this to comparison sites that they will. Economy7 and Economy10 were fairly uniform across the country. Economy 11-5,9-10,1-2:30 tariff will boggle peoples mind.

Monitoring electricity usage by appliance has been available for sometime:

https://www.smappee.com/uk/homepage?gclid=EAIaIQobChMIxcqS6tLY3gIVA-h3Ch17xALdEAAYAiAAEgICEfD_BwE

[Deleted User]

I've had a Smart meter for some years when I was last with British Gas. However, when
I switched to PFP it went "dumb" because their system couldn't / didn't use them. Having recently switched again, this time to E.on. their application form asked if I had a Smart meter installed. Having responded positively, I fully expected the system to start rolling again. WRONG! When I phoned with another unrelated query, I mentioned that I had Smart meters and was told in no uncertain terms that these were "non-compliant". When I queried this, I was again simply told that they were non-compliant and promptly cut-off. I phoned to make a complaint about such poor customer service and, thankfully, got to speak to someone with reasonable customer service skills who explained that this "non-compliance" is often the case when switching suppliers and arranged another appointment for the disconnection and removal of existing Smart meters and installation of replacement meters. Apparently this new generation of Smart meters should be able to cope with switching in the future. We shall see ........... Lesson learned!

Former_E.ON_Company_Representative:_Malc

Ameh wrote: »

I've had a Smart meter for some years when I was last with British Gas. However, when
I switched to PFP it went "dumb" because their system couldn't / didn't use them. Having recently switched again, this time to E.on. their application form asked if I had a Smart meter installed. Having responded positively, I fully expected the system to start rolling again. WRONG! When I phoned with another unrelated query, I mentioned that I had Smart meters and was told in no uncertain terms that these were "non-compliant". When I queried this, I was again simply told that they were non-compliant and promptly cut-off. I phoned to make a complaint about such poor customer service and, thankfully, got to speak to someone with reasonable customer service skills who explained that this "non-compliance" is often the case when switching suppliers and arranged another appointment for the disconnection and removal of existing Smart meters and installation of replacement meters. Apparently this new generation of Smart meters should be able to cope with switching in the future. We shall see ........... Lesson learned!

Hello Ameh and welcome to the Forums.

I'm sorry you had such a poor response when you first phoned but pleased the advisor looking after your complaint sorted new smart meters for you.

It sounds like we're fitting the new SMETS2 smart meters. These allow customers to change supplier without losing the smart features on their meters.

[FONT=&quot]Although we plan to remotely upgrade many of the SMETS1 meters already installed so they work in a similar way to SMETS2, there are some early installations where this won't be possible. I suspect this was the case here.[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]Sorry again this wasn't handled properly when you first asked [/FONT]Ameh.

Malc

EachPenny

jcontest wrote: »

On a side note and back to lekky cars, many installed car charging points that I know about are connected via 2g/3g to give that data back for the DNO if they want to use it. It doesn't mean all future charging points will be that way, but I know the kit I had, and that others received at that time, all uploaded usage data.

It doesn't take a huge leap to imagine a situation where the monitoring technology is embedded into the car, not the charge point, and that the car (perhaps via the HAN) reports back consumption for taxation purposes.

It would be a trivial exercise to then extend that to differential pricing depending on the time of day the charging took place (and perhaps when the car was used).

That could kill two policy birds with one stone - both regulating consumption of energy during peak times, and disincentivising vehicle use at peak traffic times.

It is a bold statement to say "It will never be per-appliance".

JohnB47

E.ON_Company_Representative:_Malc wrote: »

It sounds like we're fitting the new SMETS2 smart meters.

Malc

Hmmm, so you haven't bothered to find out?

brewerdave

JohnB47 wrote: »

Hmmm, so you haven't bothered to find out?

Think its far more likely that they are fitting their own "non compliant" meters:rotfl:

Former_E.ON_Company_Representative:_Malc

JohnB47 wrote: »

Hmmm, so you haven't bothered to find out?

That's right JohnB47. Without knowing who Ameh is or their address details, I've no way of tracing their account to see if they're having SMETS2 meters. As I say, I suspect they are but I'm guessing.

Ameh - our technician will confirm the meter type on arrival. Also, our smart meter teams will be able to let you know.

Malc

Michaelw

Over 140,000 SMETS2 meters have been installed

Both suppliers and the Data Communications Company, the company which manages the smart metering data and communications infrastructure, are targeting a quarter of a million SMETS2 meters by the end of the year.

https://utilityweek.co.uk/140000-smets2-meters-installed/