Smart Meters

Gerry1

Talldave said:

Whilst it is technically possible to spot consumption footprints for some devices (eg devices with constant load such as kettles, fridges, freezers, boilers) the TV is one device where consumption will vary considerably based on content and brightness, making it very difficult to track. And of course smart meters are incapable of doing any such realtime analysis anyway.

Of course the smart meter itself won't be doing any realtime analysis, but all the data it keeps sending back can certainly be used to analyse your private life.  EDF Energy is working with British analytics company Onzo.

https://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/bills/article-7576605/The-Smart-Meter-snoopers-homes-tracking-energy-habits.html

Onzo say they can 'monetise' smart meter data by offering it to third parties. They boast that they can use the data to 'build a highly personalised profile' that allows utility companies to execute 'highly targeted sales campaigns'.  Here's their creepy video.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YIkT5GmoIgQ

sparrowhawk123

Like I said, there are sources of information out there for and against this type of technology. There are people who feel there is

nothing to be concerned about, and people who feel there are many reasons to say NO to this technology. For people to make an informed decision, they need to be aware that there is also information available that disagrees with the roll out of this technology. People need to research for themselves, and have the human right to make a decision as to what they feel is correct.

carl.waring

Gerry1 said:

Talldave said:

Whilst it is technically possible to spot consumption footprints for some devices (eg devices with constant load such as kettles, fridges, freezers, boilers) the TV is one device where consumption will vary considerably based on content and brightness, making it very difficult to track. And of course smart meters are incapable of doing any such realtime analysis anyway.

Of course the smart meter itself won't be doing any realtime analysis, but all the data it keeps sending back can certainly be used to analyse your private life.  EDF Energy is working with British analytics company Onzo.

https://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/bills/article-7576605/The-Smart-Meter-snoopers-homes-tracking-energy-habits.html

Onzo say they can 'monetise' smart meter data by offering it to third parties. They boast that they can use the data to 'build a highly personalised profile' that allows utility companies to execute 'highly targeted sales campaigns'.  Here's their creepy video.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YIkT5GmoIgQ

Like it or not, that's factual evidence. So thanks.

However.....

sparrowhawk123 said:

Like I said, there are sources of information out there for and against this type of technology. There are people who feel there is nothing to be concerned about, and people who feel there are many reasons to say NO to this technology. For people to make an informed decision, they need to be aware that there is also information available that disagrees with the roll out of this technology. People need to research for themselves, and have the human right to make a decision as to what they feel is correct. 

Proper actual facts and figures for and against are fine. Except that what these sites and videos you have mentioned are just repeating useless misinformation; as I have previously clearly demonstrated.

sparrowhawk123

As I said, people can inform themselves with the information that is available and make their own decisions as to what they feel is misinformation, what they feel is propaganda, and what resonates with them. I wish you all the best.

johnc

aurion22 said:

I had a Smart Meter fitted but regret it for several reasons:

1. The display unit didn't work at all for the first few months and it took many calls/emails to get it working but then only intermittently so I've turned it off. 
2. The meter is much harder to read than the old one and takes up more space in the cupboard. 
3. The meter didn't send readings to my supplier so it looked as if my account was massively in credit. When I asked for a refund they realised there was a problem and hurriedly calculated how much I'd used in 3 months! 

My experience has been that getting a Smart Meter was just a series of aggravations so I would agree with your electrician: don't bother!
:-(
Loretta 

Thanks Loretta - was this the second generation Smart meter you had? 

johnc

Gerry1 said:

johnc said:

I would love to see for instance whether my Fridge/Freezer is causing my electric bill to go up by looking at the usage overnight for instance.

You certainly don't need a smart meter to do that !  Even if it has a spinning disk and pointy dials, you can easily read the meter last thing at night and first thing in the morning and see how many kWh you have used.

Better still, if it is a modern non-smart meter you can easily measure the consumption at any given time just by looking at the red flashing light.  For example, if it says '1000 Impulses per kWh' and it flashes every 30 seconds that's 120 flashes per hour which works out at 0.120 kWh per hour so you're using 120W.

Thats interesting - I don't have one that has a red flashing light but an older one than that. But since my bills have been much higher over the last few months than in previous years I am wondering whether my meter is faulty or whether my fridge freezer that's icing up could be responsible for my bill being double than usual? Any ideas? 

carl.waring

Either  of those sounds plausible, johnc. Though the latter less likely as I don't think that would necessarily "double" your usage.

victor2

carl.waring said:

Either  of those sounds plausible, johnc. Though the latter less likely as I don't think that would necessarily "double" your usage.

It does depend how much extra "double" is, but if the fridge/freezer is supposed to be a frost-free model, they can have a heating element inside them, which uses quite a bit more electricity than the normal compressor does. That's my experience with my ageing fridge freezer anyway. If the heating element is faulty and permanently on, then the compressor could also be running much more than usual to offset it. Don't understand why it is icing up in that scenario though. Easiest way to check would be to put one of those plug-in energfy monitors into the socket the fridge freezer is using and see how much it uses over, say, a 24 hour period.

Gerry1

johnc said:

But since my bills have been much higher over the last few months than in previous years I am wondering whether my meter is faulty or whether my fridge freezer that's icing up could be responsible for my bill being double than usual? Any ideas? 

Your train of thought is a bit derailed !  What's most important is the consumption in kWh from actual meter readings, leave the bills until later.  TBH you're probably clutching at straws thinking that the meter may be over recording, especially if it's an older mechanical one, but it's easy to rule it out.  Unplug / switch off absolutely everything, read the meter, then switch on an appliance of known high rating for an hour (e.g. a 3kW three bar electric fire or 3kW fan heater), making sure the thermostat doesn't kick in at any point.  Not 100% accurate because the appliance may not be exactly 3kW and the consumption varies with the supply voltage, but if you've clocked up significantly more than 3kWh you can then investigate the meter further.

Back to the bills.  Do they show higher DD amounts, or higher calculated £ from estimated readings, or genuinely increased kWh from actual meter readings?  The first two can be very misleading, see https://www.moneysavingexpert.com/utilities/lower-energy-direct-debits/#whatyoupay

And of course, your prices (pence per kWh and daily standing charge) have probably risen over the years.

So do some detective work before resorting to an expensive meter check - and defrost that freezer !

[Deleted User]

My very strong advice to anyone considering whether to install a smart meter is - DON’T.  We installed a smart meter two years ago.  When we changed suppliers from OVO to Bulb the meter became inactive.  It has taken us six months since then to try to sort out the subsequent problems with both electricity and gas supply.

Electricity – it was unclear for five months what readings we should send to our new supplier despite six requests for clarification.  We do now know what readings to send – apparently our meter has switched from a two-rate to single rate.  Fortunately we don’t use much overnight electricity.

Gas – after taking a reading finally when the electricity was sorted out, we were given a bill for twice as much gas in 6 months as we normally use in a year.  Again after a month of back and forth to our supplier I finally worked out that the reading we sent was taken as 100 cu.ft. instead of cu. m.  I still think there is a problem as a simple test by heating up water and checking its temperature suggests the new bill is still too high.  So our struggle for clarification continues take up enormous amounts of time.

So smart meters? – don’t.