Brexit, the economy and house prices part 5

Arklight

Rinoa wrote: »

Scots set to smash Brexit? Hardly. The bill will still be passed.

Hopefully the rebellious scots will then have a hissy fit, vote for independence and save us £15Bn every year.

Oh is that like how we are going to save £350 million a week for the NHS, when it actually means the NHS is worse off by hundreds of millions thanks to Brexit?

Great, looking forward to that.

Thrugelmir

Ballard wrote: »

Interesting article in the Telegraph which casts some doubt on the idea that the USA are planning to give us a decent deal as soon as we!!!8217;re able to sign. It also paints a less than cheery picture of the NHS being better off post Brexit but I doubt that too many people took this seriously anyway.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2018/05/15/trump-threatens-use-us-trade-talks-force-nhs-pay-drugs/

Seems minor.............

EU paid Airbus billions in illegal subsidies, WTO rules

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-44120525

buglawton

ilovehouses wrote: »

The government seem unable to agree on an approach to brexit and seems to have lost sight of the fact that, no matter what they decide, it still needs to be agreed with the EU.

Can't be too many weeks away from something giving. Boris resignation? General election? Extended transition period?

I'd like to say it's interesting times but it's just getting tedious now.

A Brexit General Election. Might sort out MPs real loyalties. I can see a lot of single-issue independent candidates popping up.

Arklight

Thrugelmir wrote: »

Seems minor.............

EU paid Airbus billions in illegal subsidies, WTO rules

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-44120525

Which is exactly the same as the illegal subsidies the US gives to Boeing. With the same WTO ruling, against them.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-38131611

In a landmark trade ruling, the World Trade Organization will this afternoon find Boeing has illegally benefitted from billions of dollars from the most anti-competitive type of subsidy.

For anyone interested in this long and bitter American trade war against Europe, rather than just demonising the EU, this is another classic example of how European nations can only repel foreign bullying by working together.

This dispute was started by the Americans. They provide billions of taxpayer dollars to Boeing, ostensibly for military contracts, which Boeing uses to subsidise it's civilian airliner business.

When Airbus (partly state owned) started eating into Boeing's market share, by making better planes, the Americans became incensed and demanded that the laws they don't think should apply to them should apply to Airbus and it should go out of business.

The clout of the EU means that Europe can circle the wagons and absorb the fines, protecting European and British jobs, exactly as "we" do with fines for refusing American Frankenfoods, GMO, chlorine washed chicken and hormone saturated American beef.

Of course all that's coming to an end now thanks to Brexit nitwits. The UK will just have to kowtow to whoever is the biggest international bully.

wunferall

Arklight wrote: »

Of course all that's coming to an end now thanks to Brexit nitwits. The UK will just have to kowtow to whoever is the biggest international bully.

No, the UK are in the process of leaving the "biggest international bully" that being the EU. After that rabble anything else will be a walk in the park.

Herzlos

wunferall wrote: »

No, the UK are in the process of leaving the "biggest international bully" that being the EU. After that rabble anything else will be a walk in the park.

Assuming the EU is that bully for a moment, what do you think will happen to us in regards to bullying, once we're no longer in that bullies gang?

Will the bully go "that weak individual left, so lets leave him alone"? or will the bully go "lets boss that weak individual around, since we're so much bigger than him"?
How will the other big bullies react to the small fry that's now unprotected?



Your argument sort of makes sense if you feel we won't need to interact with the EU at some point.

Castle

buglawton wrote: »

A Brexit General Election. Might sort out MPs real loyalties. I can see a lot of single-issue independent candidates popping up.

I thought we had one last June.:)

Arklight

Herzlos wrote: »

Assuming the EU is that bully for a moment, what do you think will happen to us in regards to bullying, once we're no longer in that bullies gang?

Will the bully go "that weak individual left, so lets leave him alone"? or will the bully go "lets boss that weak individual around, since we're so much bigger than him"?
How will the other big bullies react to the small fry that's now unprotected?



Your argument sort of makes sense if you feel we won't need to interact with the EU at some point.

What this does highlight is that the UK will be repeatedly put in an impossible situation every time something like this emerges.

As we know Airbus is threatening to leave the UK completely:

https://www.theguardian.com/business/2018/mar/05/airbus-may-leave-uk-unless-there-is-urgent-clarity-on-brexit-trade

Even if it doesn't initially, the Americans aren't going to allow the UK to continue making "subsidised" aeroplane wings for Airbus and also get a post Brexit trade deal. The EU aren't going to swallow the UK's portion of the fines either.

In reality Brexit is most likely the beginning of the end of a viable British aerospace industry.

We're already out of Galileo, which is predominantly civilian, we aren't going to be involved in anything involving EU security. BAE, which only notionally British now, has shown little loyalty to the UK and is unlikely to focus R&D in the UK if it will cost them American and European contracts.

The alternative of course is that we go properly independent like the Brexitheads keep squawking about and invest in our own fully fledged aerospace industry.

Unfortunately they are all very keen on marching out and voting Tory at every available opportunity - a party that hates universities, and won't fund investment in anything other than lobbying for a return of fox hunting.

Enterprise_1701C

Herzlos wrote: »

Assuming the EU is that bully for a moment, what do you think will happen to us in regards to bullying, once we're no longer in that bullies gang?

Will the bully go "that weak individual left, so lets leave him alone"? or will the bully go "lets boss that weak individual around, since we're so much bigger than him"?
How will the other big bullies react to the small fry that's now unprotected?



Your argument sort of makes sense if you feel we won't need to interact with the EU at some point.

Well, if being in the gang means you get absolutely zero help when Spain cause problems at the Gibralter border, and the rest of the gang stand by whilst a big one of their members (again Spain) kicks a little one (Catalonia) half to death, you really have to question if you are in the right gang,

And if that gang forces you to open your doors and let in strangers, even though it was them that invited them, again it has to be the wrong gang.

As for how the bullies react when we leave, does it not say somehwhere, in one of their policies of whatever, that they have to be nice to their neighbours. Knowing them though, they will probably re-write it as it is inconvenient.

cogito

ilovehouses wrote: »

MPs are loyal to whatever gets them voted in. A GE would focus minds on what people will vote for.

The trouble is that politicians simply view us as untermensch whose votes are to be harvested to get them elected. After that, they feel that they can do as they please.

The referendum was the first chance that the British people had to vote for anything meaningful in decades and the fact that so many politicians feel comfortable in ignoring the result tells you everything you need to know about them.