Brexit, the economy and house prices part 5

Herzlos

Only in as much as the boundary changes allow you to. You still have no say in the Lords or those appointed by the party for whom you voted in an individual.

To claim the EU is undemocratic whilst ignoring the problems with the British system is ill founded and hypocritical.

HAMISH_MCTAVISH wrote: »

You've just described the British state.

He wants good old fashioned British unelected, unaccountable elites, with traditional British corruption.

Herzlos

ukcarper wrote: »

Citizens of many countries including USAand Australia do not need a visa to travel to E.U. for less than 90 days do you really think E.U. would treat us differently.

It depends on how we treat EU citizens. Will we allow EU citizens visa free travel to the UK? If we do that, but don't allow them any rights to work, will that keep the Brexiteers happy?

ukcarper

Herzlos wrote: »

It depends on how we treat EU citizens. Will we allow EU citizens visa free travel to the UK? If we do that, but don't allow them any rights to work, will that keep the Brexiteers happy?

If we offer E.U. citizens the right to travel to UK for holidays etc which I fully expect we will and they do not reciprocate then that would show E.U in a very bad light and probably convince me I made the wrong decision by voting remain. There are many reasons to be concerned but continually inventing problems that have a tiny chance of happening if at all does your argument no favours.

phillw

cogito wrote: »

I can elect my owm MP and I can elect my own MEP. The difference is that my MP can propose legislation but my MEP cannot. My MEP can only discuss legislation handed down to him by the EU Commission.

I did not vote for them and I cannot get rid of them which makes them completely unaccountable to anyone but themselves. In what way is that democratic?

You realise the commissioners are appointed by individual member states & that the elected parliament can remove them with a vote of no confidence?

Which makes them as democratic as our prime minister and house of lords. You don't directly get to vote for either of those in the UK either. I guess you drank Nigels koolaid.

cogito

phillw wrote: »

You realise the commissioners are appointed by individual member states & that the elected parliament can remove them with a vote of no confidence?

Which makes them as democratic as our prime minister and house of lords. You don't directly get to vote for either of those in the UK either. I guess you drank Nigels koolaid.

OK. I get it. You'd much rather be governed by politicians from bastions of democracy like Poland and Hungary whose sole interest is how much they can extract from the EU rather than what they can contribute to it. Personally, I prefer our own politicians for all their faults.

westernpromise

bastions of democracy like Poland and Hungary whose sole interest is how much they can extract from the EU rather than what they can contribute to it.

You mean like Labour voters? They're always on about stuff they want for nothing, but they're never prepared to put their hands in their pockets to pay for any of it because they always think it should be "the rich" who do.

"The rich" means anyone they envy or resent for being smart, hard-working or especially both.

Rough_Justice

cogito wrote: »

OK. I get it. You'd much rather be governed by politicians from bastions of democracy like Poland and Hungary whose sole interest is how much they can extract from the EU rather than what they can contribute to it. Personally, I prefer our own politicians for all their faults.

As do the majority.

FYI there has long been talk of disbanding the House Of Lords. We the British people are able to support a government which proposes that ( as the Tory government threatened not long ago).

Maybe the disbeliever could explain how the people of the UK can vote and express their feelings for EU bureaucracy?
Oh, hang on ....................

Rough_Justice

Has no-one mentioned the EU's powdered milk mountain this week?
Another excellent example of just how well (not) the EU's farming policy works.

Farmers protesting collapsing milk prices bury the EU under ton of powdered milk

"Our farmers have been so rattled by the crisis that only a real price increase and long-term stability in the market can save milk production across the EU from extinction," said Erwin Schopges, a leader of the European Milk Board alliance of dairy farmers.

http://www.dw.com/en/farmers-protesting-collapsing-milk-prices-bury-the-eu-under-ton-of-powdered-milk/a-37244986

A report last week from the EU Milk Market Observatory said the powdered milk stockpile now stands at nearly 380,000 tonnes, and dairy producers are warning that selling it off risks throwing an already fragile market into turmoil.

http://www.seeddaily.com/reports/Dairy_sector_trembles_at_EU_powdered_milk_mountain_999.html

Rough_Justice

A reasonably sensible POV of Boris's forthright attitude to Brexit:

Boris is spot on in his lonely bid to make the positive case for Brexit

http://www.cityam.com/279495/boris-spot-his-lonely-bid-make-positive-case-brexit

I know by now that posting such material here is akin to lighting the blue touchpaper for some, remainers especially.
Well if these remainers really want May to hang on in there and deliver their beloved "soft Brexit" it really does not look at all certain.
For a variety of reasons.

kabayiri

cogito wrote: »

OK. I get it. You'd much rather be governed by politicians from bastions of democracy like Poland and Hungary whose sole interest is how much they can extract from the EU rather than what they can contribute to it. Personally, I prefer our own politicians for all their faults.

Surely, FOM - which we still have, means that anyone who prefers the EU democratic system can go and move to an EU country with a model closer to that?

I hear all these Remainers bang on about FOM, but I know very few who follow up on their words and move to Poland or Hungary.