Electric cars

buglawton

AdrianC wrote: »

Now look at the cost to replace the touchscreen in the centre console of a car that's been out of production for six or seven years, and which is needed for everything from HVAC to audio to nav to vehicle config menus.

All of which is entirely in the gift of the manufacturer. Some will want to earn a decent reputation. Plus there are laws on spare part availability and on not blocking after-market parts and tools.

Gloomendoom

buglawton wrote: »

OK Gloom, I've got around to doing the 'will you Google that for me' step you wanted and got a very ballpark figure which of course one could discuss in itself over the horizon:

https://www.quora.com/How-many-moving-parts-does-an-electric-car-have

...apples to apples comparison

EV
Single Motor design 30 - 40 Moving parts total

ICE
Several hundreds of moving parts... the biggest count savings are in the motor and gearbox, obviously... electric cars should be dramatically more reliable.

And of course IMO, that reliability should also reflect back into ease of manufacturing and quality control, dramatically fewer recalls and warranty costs thus allowing a lower sticker price...I'd take Tesla and his high end pals out of this equation as that's something of a vanity project. I'm talking urban runabouts here.

If you meant moving parts, you should have said moving parts. From a production point of view it doesn't really matter whether the parts move or not. They still exist and have to be assembled... and that costs money.

How many parts in a typical EV battery?

AdrianC

There aren't laws on parts availability - there are "gentleman's agreements". And they say everything for 3yrs, parts required for roadworthiness for 10yrs after the end of manufacture.

They're widely ignored.

gzoom

AdrianC wrote: »

Now look at the cost to replace the touchscreen in the centre console of a car that's been out of production for six or seven years, and which is needed for everything from HVAC to audio to nav to vehicle config menus.

And you care because????


We fully intend to keep our car with a touchscreen way past its warranty period. If costs are your main concern by a £500 banger with a MOT, that's always been, and always will be the cheapest form of motoring.

buglawton

Gloomendoom wrote: »

If you meant moving parts, you should have said moving parts. From a production point of view it doesn't really matter whether the parts move or not. They still exist and have to be assembled... and that costs money.

How many parts in a typical EV battery?

I used the phrase drive chain (meaning drive train of course) advisedly.

AdrianC

gzoom wrote: »

And you care because????

We fully intend to keep our car with a touchscreen way past its warranty period. If costs are your main concern by a £500 banger with a MOT, that's always been, and always will be the cheapest form of motoring.

Lovely. And when that touchscreen has a sulk, effectively writing an otherwise perfectly good car off...

buglawton

AdrianC wrote: »

Lovely. And when that touchscreen has a sulk, effectively writing an otherwise perfectly good car off...

Just like a failed automatic gearbox wrote my neighbours 6 year old diesel car off then.

Martyn1981

Gloomendoom wrote: »

If you meant moving parts, you should have said moving parts. From a production point of view it doesn't really matter whether the parts move or not. They still exist and have to be assembled... and that costs money.

Not sure if you are doing this deliberately or not, but the issue of 'moving parts' is extremely important as it is moving parts that wear and typically fail needing replacement.

That's why PV with no moving parts has extremely low OPEX and can balance out the higher capacity factor but also higher OPEX of wind turbines to achieve similar costs of generation when all factors are considered.

In the case of EV's 'moving parts' is something that gets mentioned one hell of a lot when discussing the reason behind the far, far lower cost of maintenance and servicing v's an ICE.

How many parts in a typical EV battery?

Moving parts - none I think.

Also it depends on your definition of a battery, since putting two batteries together gives you one battery, so you may argue that a battery is one item, or thousands of items (cells), and I suspect you will argue whatever ........ ensures an argument.

custardy

buglawton wrote: »

I've never had an electronic device that has mysteriously broken down no matter how old. Got some old 2G Nokias in a draw, 13 years old, work perfectly. I've had a number of more recent devices go defunct due to firmware updates dropping the performance (needing more memory etc) and ecosystem changes. There were some valve radios in the family that lasted 50 years with one repair between them.

Had a 'fly by wire' throttle body die on the car with no previous symptoms, just a couple of months ago.
Perhaps a more applicable comparison?

buglawton

Martyn1981 wrote: »

Not sure if you are doing this deliberately or not, but the issue of 'moving parts' is extremely important as it is moving parts that wear and typically fail needing replacement.

......

Also it depends on your definition of a battery, since putting two batteries together gives you one battery, so you may argue that a battery is one item, or thousands of items (cells), and I suspect you will argue whatever ........ ensures an argument.

Exactly.
And after all, the electrons in a battery do shift about, next question will be how many moving electron parts in an EV battery