Britain can be better off outside Europe

Kohoutek

CLAPTON wrote: »

most farmers/ manufactures/ retail/ etc want monopolies or cartels:
I also believe that anyone called CLAPTON should be paid a special tax free pension of £1million each week because it is 'fair'.

It's not about monopolies or cartels; it's about greater foreign competition and the potential loss of UK jobs as a result.

Conrad

When it comes to us leaving the EU I see it as a statement of fact, not as something to be negotiated, per see.

We are not a conquered people, we have no need to surrender to the demands of an occupying force.

Kohoutek

Conrad wrote: »

No I do not accept your somewhat simplistic distillation of bilateral trade deals as being necessarily of master and servant asymmetry, for far more reasons than I care to go into.

Okay. well clearly you're only interested in silly assertions and hyperbole. I never said "master and servant asymmetry" or anything like that.

Kohoutek

Conrad wrote: »

When it comes to us leaving the EU I see it as a statement of fact, not as something to be negotiated, per see.

We are not a conquered people, we have no need to surrender to the demands of an occupying force.

I'm starting to wonder whether you really support remain and you're trying to satirise leave supporters by these increasing unhinged and odd posts.

Conrad

Kohoutek wrote: »

Okay. well clearly you're only interested in silly assertions and hyperbole. I never said "master and servant asymmetry" or anything like that.

You said there is inequity between the larger and smaller trading bloc going into a negotiation, ergo, negotiating asymmetry. I believe it's more nuanced and depends what each side has to offer and what it wants, beyond simply size of market considerations

I've never gone along with the notion we are somehow stronger in the EU bloc. I've talked many times of the leveredge our soft power, unrivalled dynamism and deep historic links will afford us, greeted with dismissal from the Bremainers

As a little aside, this little insignificant island in the N Atlantic came second in the Olympics, and yes that counts for something worth a ponder

gfplux

daveyjp wrote: »

Whilst it may be 2 meg and 180 pages, that is at least a comprehensive impact assessment.

Was anything like this available 6 months ago? From what people are saying about lack of information it appears not.

Nothing like it was generally available. I imagine that inside Government and certainly in big Corporations some money and time was spent analysing the potentials of either a in or out vote.

Here is another paper on Brexit published by another think tank Chathemhouse.
https://www.chathamhouse.org/publications/twt/preparing-uks-brexit-negotiation

There is a lot of energy on this and other forums being used to justify why people voted in or out. Some have forgotten the referendum is over. We voted out. Now we need to concentrate on getting out not raking over the past.

gfplux

Chathemhouse have published an article on the forthcoming negotiations.

https://www.chathamhouse.org/publications/twt/preparing-uks-brexit-negotiation
It's a long read but here is the first paragraph.

"Theresa May, the new British prime minister, faces a central challenge in deciding the UK’s next steps towards the EU. On the one hand, a clear majority of the British electorate voted in the 23 June referendum for Britain to leave the EU. She has no choice but to follow through on the result. On the other, Leave supporters did not vote for a specific version of Brexit. Alongside the many who were determined to free the country from the costs and constraints of EU membership, the majority included an anti-austerity and anti-globalization protest vote and those with a vision of a buccaneering ‘global Britain’. - See more at:"

https://www.chathamhouse.org/publications/twt/preparing-uks-brexit-negotiation#sthash.vnQLUrgW.dpuf

Those wearing tin foil hats will also think this is biased, why, don't ask me, ask the crazy one.

Why can't we all except that these papers from various "think tanks" all add to our collective knowledge and help us understand how to move forward.
Those saying that it is bias to suggest that the process of Brexit will be complicated are insulting those that will have to do the negotiating.

mwpt

Conrad wrote: »

As a little aside, this little insignificant island in the N Atlantic came second in the Olympics, and yes that counts for something worth a ponder

Do you think that is superior genetics or do you think our training and sports programmes have something to do with it? Those cost money. A lot of money. That comes from our people ultimately and that comes from our economic prosperity. And we achieved this while being in the EU. We "came second" in the Olympics while being part of the EU! Just think of that achievement. I reckon the EU has been incredibly good for Britain. I don't know why you are so negative about it. Try being more positive.

TrickyTree83

mwpt wrote: »

Do you think that is superior genetics or do you think our training and sports programmes have something to do with it? Those cost money. A lot of money. That comes from our people ultimately and that comes from our economic prosperity. And we achieved this while being in the EU. We "came second" in the Olympics while being part of the EU! Just think of that achievement. I reckon the EU has been incredibly good for Britain. I don't know why you are so negative about it. Try being more positive.

I think that's tenuous to try to link the EU with the UK's Olympic achievements.

What's the excuse for the other countries in the EU?

As I recall, during the Olympics, the other countries competing put our success down to our funding system via the national lottery.

mwpt

TrickyTree83 wrote: »

I think that's tenuous to try to link the EU with the UK's Olympic achievements.

What's the excuse for the other countries in the EU?

As I recall, during the Olympics, the other countries competing put our success down to our funding system via the national lottery.

Exactly. We are running a successful economy as part of the EU. Glad to see finally a positive note from a brexiter about the EU.