Can UK veto Turkey?

TrickyTree83

cells wrote: »

migrants do not just add to supply of labor they add to demand of goods and services.

I agree, they add to the supply of labour, increasing competition for jobs causing employers to have the upper hand enabling them to dish out zero hour contracts on minimum wage without worrying about whether the position will be filled or not, they know it will. If a UK citizen won't do it, someone from an EU country with a lower minimum wage will.

cells wrote: »

Its unlikely they have much of a net surplus to supply than to demand. Very few people native or migrant have a big surplus of labor v demands.

But if that was genuinely the case then there would be little need for the government to enforce wage rises the way they have done. It should as free market economics dictates, correct itself. Why hasn't it? I propose that access to the EU labour market is either the main factor or at least a major contributing factor to wage compression.

cells wrote: »

also unemployment in the UK is low, about 5% and much lower yet if you look at those unemployed for 6 months or more (something like 2%). So if unemployment is about 2% and the migrants are doing all the low paid crap jobs that must mean the locals who would be doing those jobs if there were no migrants are instead doing higher paid better jobs.

I can't see how you came to the conclusion that UK citizens must be in better paying jobs because unemployment is low. I also know that migrants are not just doing low paid work, my wife (Ukrainian) certainly isn't, and friends of ours from the Russian speaking nations in the EU certainly aren't on minimum wage either, it's a mixture of wages. But the impetus for employers to raise wages to attract staff is not there because if someone already in the country (non-UK citizen or UK citizen) does not want to do the work for that wage there will be someone in the former Eastern bloc countries who will. There lies the problem, the minimum wage compression continues and the free market doesn't deliver wage increases in line with the cost of living - hence the government recently stepping in to attempt to rectify the situation. Incidentally all that will do is increase migration whilst also increasing living costs as companies increase consumer costs to cover the wage rises.

CLAPTON

mayonnaise wrote: »

Yup. Deporting a few millions of young, healthy and economically active EU workers and exchanging them for a few million geriatric costa des sollers will do miracles for the NHS. Hey, at least we'll have control over our borders.

you do rather display an unatrractive and some vile attitude to older people.I trust people treat you will more respect when you age.

CLAPTON

cells wrote: »

trying to project that fear Clapton?

Much fewer turks will come than did poles no conceivable outcome points to more.




maybe that is the reason they are not welcomed with open arms. Its probably easier for Germany/France to admit a bunch of small poor countries than to admit a country the size of Germany and the wealth of italy which might actually have political power within the EU of a scale which might make Germany dominance a little harder.

have the courage of your convictions (even if they do vary from post to post)
if you believe in unlimitied immigration then have the courage to say so
if you want Turkey and maybe the other Med countries to have unlimitd freedom of movement then just have the courage to say so.

How is it project fear to support your own views?

System

I think the remain camp just simply want to remain to be able to veto turkey

cells

CLAPTON wrote: »

have the courage of your convictions (even if they do vary from post to post)
if you believe in unlimitied immigration then have the courage to say so
if you want Turkey and maybe the other Med countries to have unlimitd freedom of movement then just have the courage to say so.

How is it project fear to support your own views?

yes I believe in free movement of people of all nations in the long term. I think possibly it will happen next century ie sometime in 2100-2200

The abnormal period will be seen as the ~1900-2100 period of restricted movement of people not what will be the norm of millions of years of humans not being contained by invisible lines dictated by place of birth

cells

CLAPTON wrote: »

How is it project fear to support your own views?

if your view is that many millions of turks will come to the uk then you are wrong

if your view is that many millions of turks will not come to the uk, yet you portray that as likely, then you are using propaganda and trying to project fear so people will vote not on likely outcomes but on fear.

cells

We dont know what the future holds but I hope its better than a couple of hundred tribes drawing invisible lines and pointing sharpened sticks at any of their long lost relatives who might want to walk towards their invisible lines.

CLAPTON

cells wrote: »

yes I believe in free movement of people of all nations in the long term. I think possibly it will happen next century ie sometime in 2100-2200

The abnormal period will be seen as the ~1900-2100 period of restricted movement of people not what will be the norm of millions of years of humans not being contained by invisible lines dictated by place of birth

any hypocrite can 'believe' in something but say not for hundreds of years.

CLAPTON

ruggedtoast wrote: »

I want free movement of people within the EU, for a start, and for people like you to vanish up your own arrises, or 1952 where you will fit in, whichever will enable your departure soonest.

you have made it very clear that you are terrified of non white non christian people and want nothing to do with them.

TrickyTree83

cells wrote: »

yes I believe in free movement of people of all nations in the long term. I think possibly it will happen next century ie sometime in 2100-2200

The abnormal period will be seen as the ~1900-2100 period of restricted movement of people not what will be the norm of millions of years of humans not being contained by invisible lines dictated by place of birth

For that to happen so many things will have to change. Here's just a few to illustrate how difficult it will be to achieve that:

Money will have to disappear.

Religion will have to disappear.

Energy and food will need to be abundant. Which means...

Our reliance on any kind of fossil fuel will need to have been consigned to history.