Can UK veto Turkey?

CLAPTON

HAMISH_MCTAVISH wrote: »

Negotiations have been ongoing since 1997.

If it was that easy Turkey would have done so already.



Giving up their claim would only be the start of it.

You've then got hugely complicated and potentially unresolvable issues around compensation, rights of settlers since, rights of return for those who left, property ownership, etc etc etc.

And that between two countries with a deep and long lasting animosity and lack of trust towards each other.

And even after all that, any country in the EU can still veto, just because they don't want Turkish migrants.

The entire "Turkey joining the EU in anything less than decades" scenario is nothing but "Project Fear" being used to try and panic the electorate.

I guess the argument that the EU brought and maintained peace to europe, wouldn't apply to a muslim country.

leveller2911

=HAMISH_MCTAVISH;70708162]If you have that little trust in the UK government using it's veto, and make no mistake it absolutely does have veto rights, then what on earth makes you think a UK government outside the EU would not allow mass migration anyway?

Entirely depends on what we define "mass migration".

The UK needs migrant workers but not massive,unfettered numbers of low skilled EU migrants which we cannot currently control the numbers of or plan our public services around. We just don't know how many will rock up to the UK over the next few years.

Outside the EU the UK Govt can be held accountable to the electorate for the volume of EU migrants entering the UK in the same way it can currently be held accountable for non EU migration. The fact that the current Govt makes a complete hash of controlling non EU numbers is a separate issue.

You can't have it both ways....

I never said I did want it both ways.You came to that conclusion all by yourself.

HAMISH_MCTAVISH

leveller2911 wrote: »

The fact that the current Govt makes a complete hash of controlling non EU numbers is a separate issue. .

You are making the rather large assumption that any government would materially reduce immigration.

Or that the electorate wouldn't severely punish them once the dire economic consequences of such reductions became apparent.

wymondham

HAMISH_MCTAVISH wrote: »

You are making the rather large assumption that any government would materially reduce immigration.

Or that the electorate wouldn't severely punish them once the dire economic consequences of such reductions became apparent.

At least if we're out and the Government does not reduce immigration then the electorate can effect a change by voting them out.

CLAPTON

HAMISH_MCTAVISH wrote: »

You are making the rather large assumption that any government would materially reduce immigration.

Or that the electorate wouldn't severely punish them once the dire economic consequences of such reductions became apparent.

the main dire consequence will be a reduction in the price of a small terrace house, better access to health care, less requirement to raise taxes to pay for new infrastructure, better travel experience and the opportunity to vote for our own laws.

it will be win win situation

leveller2911

HAMISH_MCTAVISH wrote: »

You are making the rather large assumption that any government would materially reduce immigration.

At least my post was based on the fact that the UK electorate has the power to elect a different Govt if they failed to control numbers.

Or that the electorate wouldn't severely punish them once the dire economic consequences of such reductions became apparent.

Now that's a huge assumption that there would be dire consequences.............
Can't have it both ways Hamish...........;)

stator

The EU is just stringing Turkey along to keep the current migrant deal going. Once the migrant problem abates somewhat the negotiations will stall again.
No-one wants to allow Turkey to join in it's current state. ie totalitarian dictatorship

HAMISH_MCTAVISH

wymondham wrote: »

At least if we're out and the Government does not reduce immigration then the electorate can effect a change by voting them out.

But if the government does materially reduce immigration the electorate will vote them out anyway because of the economic damage such a reduction would cause.

I don't have a great deal of sympathy for government in this matter though.

They could have spent the last decade explaining the economic reality to the populace rather than pandering to the anti-immigration crowd and blaming the EU when they can't even drop numbers of non-EU migrants to the tens of thousands and they know it full well.

That we still have so many deniers of that reality on here proves definitively the government has failed in it's duty in this regard.

mayonnaise

stator wrote: »

The EU is just stringing Turkey along to keep the current migrant deal going. Once the migrant problem abates somewhat the negotiations will stall again.
No-one wants to allow Turkey to join in it's current state. ie totalitarian dictatorship

Exactly.
There is no place for a totalitarian regime in the democratic club of free nations which is the EU.
The EU might negotiate a bit on visa-free travel within Schengen (not applicable to the UK by the way) and throw them some money to keep the refugee stream under control, but there is no chance at all of Turkey joining the EU within the lifetime of anyone posting on this forum.
It's just the leave campaign getting increasingly desperate, as they lost the economy argument, and are now going all out with the anti-migrant card.
This might appeal to a small group of angry, cantankerous, snowglobe collecting, little england daily express readers, but not to the decent, tolerant majority obviously.

CLAPTON

mayonnaise wrote: »

Exactly.
There is no place for a totalitarian regime in the democratic club of free nations which is the EU.
The EU might negotiate a bit on visa-free travel within Schengen (not applicable to the UK by the way) and throw them some money to keep the refugee stream under control, but there is no chance at all of Turkey joining the EU within the lifetime of anyone posting on this forum.
It's just the leave campaign getting increasingly desperate, as they lost the economy argument, and are now going all out with the anti-migrant card.
This might appeal to a small group of angry, cantankerous, snowglobe collecting, little england daily express readers, but not to the decent, tolerant majority obviously.

I thought as you, as a 'world' citizen, believed in the totally free movement of all people and so absolutley support the free entry of Turkish people to the UK right now: why would you want to hide this firm belief?