If we vote to Remain what happens?

Conrad

CLAPTON wrote: »

but you are also claiming that those 'nice' Germans are going to deliberately harm the people of Germany and the EU27 just to spite the UK

EU tariffs would harm the economies that export huge amounts to us namely Germany, France and Spain (whos fragile real estate sector is critically dependant on British home buyers).


France and Spain have high youth unemployment, of course they wont want anything to reduce their flow of goods to us.


Remain remind us the EU is economically fragile and may tip into recession if we leave, so of course they EU will swiftly want all uncertainty removed by striking a rapid trade deal with its biggest market.


On top of all this overwhelming argument, the UK would spearhead the massive Commonwealth that contains nations very strategically important to China, thus we would enjoy great trading and influential leverage with the EU as a result


Another option would be to team up with Norway and Switzerland and do a big EU deal


I love the opportunity that awaits us, this buccaneering ancient trading nation

mayonnaise

Who is the chap in your avatar, Conrad?

(sorry for the off-topic)

System

Hi

westernpromise wrote: »

It must be said that with "The Germans want to finish what zer Nazis started" and "Cameron's a liar" getting an airing lately, the Leave campaign can't really argue that their best arguments aren't being heard. When they lose shatteringly, it will be fair and square.

From the outset I've been deciding to stay away from this ridiculous referendum. Rather than type out why, David Mitchell already did it for me here. http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2016/may/29/eu-referendum-parliament-leaders-david-cameron-david-mitchell

However over the last few weeks my social media has been full of racism and lies from the Leave campaign. You're right, whatever decent argument leave has is not being heard by many people at all. People in favour of leave seem to be doing the Internet equivalent of "nanananana can't hear you" before promptly sharing another meme about Romanians stealing jobs or some EU "fact" that 5 seconds on Google will tell you is nonsense. Or just sheer ignorance, I had a friend complain on twitter that the shops in Belgium are shut on Sundays, a reply came in, "yes that's because they have the same stupid EU rules we do"... Er our shops are open on Sundays you utter cretin. It doesn't help" leave" that the charge is being led by Britain First who are still campaigning to shoot all Brown people on sight.

I'm honest enough to hold my hands up and say I have no idea what's better or worse and as a result I don't feel qualified to vote. But the Leave campaign is forcing my hand, I may not know what's best but I know who I don't want to be associated with. Remain it is. From conversations in the office and with friends I don't think my stance is very rare at all.

CLAPTON

Joeskeppi wrote: »

Hi

From the outset I've been deciding to stay away from this ridiculous referendum. Rather than type out why, David Mitchell already did it for me here. http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2016/may/29/eu-referendum-parliament-leaders-david-cameron-david-mitchell

However over the last few weeks my social media has been full of racism and lies from the Leave campaign. You're right, whatever decent argument leave has is not being heard by many people at all. People in favour of leave seem to be doing the Internet equivalent of "nanananana can't hear you" before promptly sharing another meme about Romanians stealing jobs or some EU "fact" that 5 seconds on Google will tell you is nonsense. Or just sheer ignorance, I had a friend complain on twitter that the shops in Belgium are shut on Sundays, a reply came in, "yes that's because they have the same stupid EU rules we do"... Er our shops are open on Sundays you utter cretin. It doesn't help" leave" that the charge is being led by Britain First who are still campaigning to shoot all Brown people on sight.

I'm honest enough to hold my hands up and say I have no idea what's better or worse and as a result I don't feel qualified to vote. But the Leave campaign is forcing my hand, I may not know what's best but I know who I don't want to be associated with. Remain it is. From conversations in the office and with friends I don't think my stance is very rare at all.

this would seem more a comment on your friends on social media that anything to do with the actual facts
get new friends

Conrad

mayonnaise wrote: »

Who is the chap in your avatar, Conrad?

(sorry for the off-topic)

That Sir, is me Sir taken a couple of weeks ago - that's where I sit all day, my desk in the background, with the window onto the high street.


I'd like others to follow suit - I feel seeing anonymous posters can give one a different take on them - in the case of my mug-shot>> 'who's that effing turnip head'. I have more hair than that really - looks like a dog poo'd on me

System

CLAPTON wrote: »

this would seem more a comment on your friends on social media that anything to do with the actual facts
get new friends

I don't think you know how social media works.

Conrad

Joeskeppi wrote: »

Hi



I'm honest enough to hold my hands up and say I have no idea what's better or worse and as a result I don't feel qualified to vote. But the Leave campaign is forcing my hand, I may not know what's best but I know who I don't want to be associated with. Remain it is. From conversations in the office and with friends I don't think my stance is very rare at all.

I'd urge you not to be swayed by people you dislike - why have your decision effectively made by them?


Think about the fantastic trading opportunities that lay ahead, think how proud you will be of your independent buccaneering nation with her own seat at all the global rule setting tables, heading up the mighty Commonwealth with our shared history and deep links, a grown-up nation not afraid of her own autonomy.


How cool to have control of our own fishing grounds again - Norway makes huge prosperity from hers.


On the other hand think of the fact we need to build 1 house every 4 minutes, and how we will never hope to keep up with relentless demand if we keep taking in a city the size of Cardiff annually - imagine the congestion in another 20 years, imagine London's green lung being built over for all time, imagine how we will get ever more subsumed into the EU, less autonomous


Don't let a few racists and nutters sway you man, you're bigger than that


Far from being a little Englander, you could one day soon be saying you are of a globally orientated independent confident nation

michaels

I know I am blinkered in this debate but I think it is much easier for exit to make a positive case than remain because those whole-heartedly in favour will vote remain anyway and those in the middle are put off rather than motivated by the thought of 'a glorious future within the united states of europe'

System

Conrad wrote: »

I'd urge you not to be swayed by people you dislike - why have your decision effectively made by them?


Think about the fantastic trading opportunities that lay ahead, think how proud you will be of your independent buccaneering nation with her own seat at all the global rule setting tables, heading up the mighty Commonwealth with our shared history and deep links, a grown-up nation not afraid of her own autonomy.


How cool to have control of our own fishing grounds again - Norway makes huge prosperity from hers.


On the other hand think of the fact we need to build 1 house every 4 minutes, and how we will never hope to keep up with relentless demand if we keep taking in a city the size of Cardiff annually - imagine the congestion in another 20 years, imagine London's green lung being build over for all time, imagine how we will get ever more subsumed into the EU.


Don't let a few racists and nutters sway you man, you're bigger than that

Thanks, good post.

Those all sound like good things, but isn't it fair to say no one really knows if they will come to be or not? Sometimes leave feels like a big gamble, it's a minefield trying to pick out the truth from the lies (not your post above) and speculation.

System

michaels wrote: »

I know I am blinkered in this debate but I think it is much easier for exit to make a positive case than remain because those whole-heartedly in favour will vote remain anyway and those in the middle are put off rather than motivated by the thought of 'a glorious future within the united states of europe'

Interesting, I would say those in the middle are motivated by the thought of the status quo and not what at times appears to be a big gamble.