The New Fat Scotland 'Thanks for all the Fish' Thread.

HAMISH_MCTAVISH

.string. wrote: »

being swallowed up by the US of E.

As an independent state in the EU an iScotland would have exponentially more control over it's own affairs, taxation, welfare, immigration, and laws than it does as a devolved part of the UK.

By all means point out, as I frequently do, that this would require hefty cuts to Scottish spending and likely an economically painful transitional period.

But please drop the absurd hyperbole about 'being swallowed up' in a Union that would give us far more sovereignty than the Union we're currently in, along with a veto over most major changes to that Union, unlike our current position....

elantan

Oh my Hamish your starting to sound like someone that really wants independence, I'm not quite sure how to take this

I welcome it obviously but find myself puzzled

Welcome aboard anyway

HAMISH_MCTAVISH

elantan wrote: »

Oh my Hamish your starting to sound like someone that really wants independence, I'm not quite sure how to take this

I welcome it obviously but find myself puzzled

Welcome aboard anyway

LOL... Hardly.

I still have no desire for indy and it would break my heart if Scotland was forced to leave the UK - but if Mayhem takes us out of the single market and free movement I'll be actively campaigning for an iScotland as the lesser of two evils.

Masomnia

HAMISH_MCTAVISH wrote: »

LOL... Hardly.

I still have no desire for indy and it would break my heart if Scotland was forced to leave the UK - but if Mayhem takes us out of the single market and free movement I'll be actively campaigning for an iScotland as the lesser of two evils.

I think that's looking very likely now.

In the unlikely event we remained in the single market but without free movement; ie. a bit more restriction but no automatic rights, how would that alter things?

CLAPTON

HAMISH_MCTAVISH wrote: »

Contributions are not an issue.

The UK gets back 10 times or more in economic benefit from single market membership compared to what it pays in.

I'll happily give you £1000 for £10,000 of your stuff in return.

And I even promise not to moan, whine and complain about how you spend the grand I give you.

When would you like to start?:D

completely bonkers

trade is indeed a benefit to BOTH parties and free trade is even more valuable to BOTH parties.

there is no need to pay a subscription to effect a trade but if a Iscotland wishes to pay a masssive sub to England then we will happily accept it. We will see with your mad ideas hold if England demands a massive 'fee' from Iscotland.

HAMISH_MCTAVISH

Masomnia wrote: »

I think that's looking very likely now.

I'm still optimistic the grown ups will get involved at some point and back us away form the cliff edge. We'll see in due course.

In the unlikely event we remained in the single market but without free movement; ie. a bit more restriction but no automatic rights, how would that alter things?

Scotland faces an existential threat from population decline and requires higher not lower immigration.

Scotland - Live Births


Any additional restrictions that result in lower migrant numbers are unwelcome and run contrary to Scottish government policy.

If that's what the UK chooses to do then the only way to convince me it'd be worth staying would be to fully devolve immigration policy and control to Scotland.

elantan

The indy conference is underway in Glasgow ... sold out as expected, I tried to get tickets but nae chance for me, so far it sounds interesting the people seem enthusiastic.

I think the indy supporters really have a lot to thank indylive for they film everything and let us keep up to date even if we can't make it

.string.

HAMISH_MCTAVISH wrote: »

LOL... Hardly.

I still have no desire for indy and it would break my heart if Scotland was forced to leave the UK - but if Mayhem takes us out of the single market and free movement I'll be actively campaigning for an iScotland as the lesser of two evils.

May is of course saying that we will retain acess to the single market so it is a matter of precisely what that means. Merely repeating "in the single market" as a slogan, is a substitute for thought does not become you Hamish. As for the freedom of movement thingthing, we can already see a compromise looming on that which is based around the original idea of freedom of movement for workers plus visa-free tourism.

You would be more logically served by waiting to see what, exactly, will be on the table instead of being panicked (by your SNP would-be bedfellows) into assuming a worse case scenario.

As for your remarks about not being swallowed up, you really are being incredibly naive. I would have agreed with your remark at the time of the EU referendum but times, and the political European mood, have changed since then. Now that the chief bulwark against ever closer union (the UK bolstered by the principles signed up to in Cameron's"agreement)) is leaving those particular integration forces are unleashed and unless the European populist movements gain a lot of traction shortly, Scotland would be sitting, influence wise, alongside the lesser counties as they are swamped by majority voting and the strictures of the EURO.

Have a look at the relative populations of the EU and see where Scotland would fit.

If the populist movements win out then we are talking EU breakup or at least fragmentation.

Even if you do not instinctively believe that either of those scenarios would happen in full, you should pause for thought. The one thing going for Scotland is that it is hidden away up North behind England.

Maybe after a few years, the SNP would have a new obsession, Independence from wicked Brussels.

CLAPTON

HAMISH_MCTAVISH wrote: »

I'm still optimistic the grown ups will get involved at some point and back us away form the cliff edge. We'll see in due course.



Scotland faces an existential threat from population decline and requires higher not lower immigration.

Scotland - Live Births


Any additional restrictions that result in lower migrant numbers are unwelcome and run contrary to Scottish government policy.

If that's what the UK chooses to do then the only way to convince me it'd be worth staying would be to fully devolve immigration policy and control to Scotland.

there is nothing to stop people moving from the EU to scotland now: they choose NOT to.

.string.

CLAPTON wrote: »

there is nothing to stop people moving from the EU to scotland now: they choose NOT to.

Good point. I understand that business start-ups are down

The blame for these things lies at the SNP's door with their disruptive plotting and. continual griping. They are holding the UK back, let alone just Scotland.