The New Fat Scotland 'Thanks for all the Fish' Thread.

zagubov

Tromking wrote: »

Should Scotland decide to leave the Union it would be a tad symmetrical. It would leave as it entered the Union, an economic basket case.

What an appalling indictment of political unions. There's a message there for the EU debate.

Generali

zagubov wrote: »

What an appalling indictment of political unions. There's a message there for the EU debate.

We all live in a political union of some sort. Unless you advocate anarchy we all cede some personal freedom for the convenience of living in a society.

There is nothing special about the Tweed that means that the people either side are so different that they can't share a Government any more that there is anything special about the people living either side Thames or the Murray or the Danube or the Mississippi or La Manche for that matter.

Tromking

zagubov wrote: »

What an appalling indictment of political unions. There's a message there for the EU debate.

You mean that if a newly independent Scotland joined the EU it would change from being a highly subsidised part of one Union to a nett contributor of another?

Shakethedisease

Generali wrote: »

The problem with your little fantasy is that the Scottish Government doesn't have the power or the money to call a referendum and it is highly unlikely that a Tory Government would call another one.

You had your chance and you blew it. Life doesn't often give second chances as you are about to find out.

Politics does indeed give second chances. It took two votes before Scotland got it's own parliament.

If Scottish Labour and Conservatives can only seek to increase votes in Scotland by minimising absolutely anything to do with Westminster, ( there were no Corbyn or Cameron visits up here and we've already discussed Davidson's lack of Conservative party branding ).. then even they are perhaps unwittingly, playing their part.

And at the end of the day, if the biggest reason the Conservatives won't allow another referendum in the future is because they fear or know they will lose it. Then they've lost Scotland already. The Scottish Government will just hold one anyway and Westminster's intransigence will simply boost a Yes vote even higher.

The Labour party was the only glue holding the union together and it seems Scots voters have just about reached the end of their patience there now too both in Westminster and Holyrood. Only a new Labour leader and a resurgent Labour party will harm the SNP's mid/long term aims now. And even then, they'd probably need to be open to some sort of radical Scottish Home Rule.

mollycat

Generali wrote: »

The problem with your little fantasy is that the Scottish Government doesn't have the power or the money to call a referendum and it is highly unlikely that a Tory Government would call another one.

You had your chance and you blew it. Life doesn't often give second chances as you are about to find out.

Nope, we had our chance and took it with both hands; REJECTED idiotic nationalism out of hand.

Most scots would be horrified at a second ballot, even lots of those who voted Yes.

islandannie

zagubov wrote: »

Perhaps, patient reader, by seeking to remove Scotland from the union, whose governance of Scotland may have presumably had the responsibility for causing it, before it terminally wrecks the place.

So we joined the union bankrupt and we shall leave in the same predicament?

Seems fair to me.

Leanne1812

mollycat wrote: »

Nope, we had our chance and took it with both hands; REJECTED idiotic nationalism out of hand.

Most scots would be horrified at a second ballot, even lots of those who voted Yes.

Would you have any evidence of these Yes voters who would now be horrified?

I ask simply as it is news to me. I've not heard or read anything like what you state.

islandannie

Leanne1812 wrote: »

Would you have any evidence of these Yes voters who would now be horrified?

I ask simply as it is news to me. I've not heard or read anything like what you state.

Well of course you will just have to take my word for it,but three of my employees who voted to leave the union have openly admitted that they would have been terrified if under the present circumstances we had voted for independence.

mollycat

Leanne1812 wrote: »

Would you have any evidence of these Yes voters who would now be horrified?

I ask simply as it is news to me. I've not heard or read anything like what you state.

Can't post any link or empirical evidence, only anecdotal.....

Several "yes" voters have told me they would not welcome a return to the atmosphere of 2014.

Most people in Scotland recognise time of referendum was divisive and want to move on.

People have (at last) seen through the false promise of a viable independant Scotland.

We'd be an economic desert in no time.

Swinney being taken apart on Question Time from Dundee by the audience about a month ago was tv heaven.

All nationalism is unhealthy; never really sure why we think ours is a good thing.

zagubov

islandannie wrote: »

So we joined the union bankrupt and we shall leave in the same predicament?

Seems fair to me.

So you're actually impressed that the 300 years of union got Scotland nowhere and did them no economic good whatsoever and was a complete waste of time?
Priceless! :rotfl::T