The New Fat Scotland 'Thanks for all the Fish' Thread.

Moto2

elantan wrote: »

I didn't realise Elizabeth was involved in the negotiations ?

She isn't and neither is Sturgeon

kabayiri

Thrugelmir wrote: »

What sort of Brexit does NS actually want? Or does it actually matter. As fault will be found in any event. As constantly looking for an angle to plug independence. Leave it too late and the window might close firmly again.

Single market access I expect.

I suppose that as the citizens of Southern Europe get more and more depressed, they might drink more and more whisky.

Oh, and something about renewables. Exporting clean power to Europe perhaps. (As soon as they realise the cost of subterranean cabling from Scotland to continental Europe, this will be the deadest of ducks in the water)

Shakethedisease

kabayiri wrote: »

It's true though, in so much as politicians are able to be two-faced, yet quite comfortable with it.

So, PM May might say one thing in public, with a different tone in the negotiating rooms.

Sturgeon will have to try and 'smoke them out' by exposing the reality.

And then, how do you cope with radical changes in tone in the negotiations, because the German or French elections are coming up.

All I can see is a right old dogs dinner of a mess, undecipherable to most of us.

I think the time limit side of A50 recognises this, by trying to force some kind of limit on proceedings.

Portillo could be right. Nearly 2 years of protracted discussion of stuff all, followed by a flurry of pragmatism.

Membership of the Single Market is a red line. There will also be serious question marks over Fishing, Agriculture and the Great Repeal Act going forward even if there's no Hard Brexit. All grist to the mill.

Are the SNP willing to wait right until the end?

I don't think they want it to even start. And if MP's get to vote on Theresa's May's terms, then we'll all know what the aims are before negotiations start. Probably the EU's answer to that shortly after.

I didn't think they'd also go for the Claim of Right option in the Supreme Court hearing.. as well as the Sewell Convention/Legislative consent. But the lawyers for the Scottish Govt actually have. I don't think this has been fully tested in law before ( ?) so will be very interesting following that angle.

Scottish Claim of Right to be used in Brexit case against UK government

Triggering article 50 without MPs’ vote would be in breach of Scottish law, says court submission pointing to 1689 act

..Scotland’s Claim of Right Act 1689, the year after England’s weaker Bill of Rights was drafted. It codified the “radical revolutionary tradition” in Scotland that a monarch was always answerable to the law and the people, in this case its parliaments, he says...

..Scotland’s chief law officer has also been asked to address the 11 supreme court judges on specific areas of Scots law which are affected by Brexit. In a brief submission to the court, the lord advocate, James Wolffe QC, said the claim of right made “a unilateral act of the crown” on this issue unlawful.

O’Neill’s submission argues: “The contemporary significance and resonance of this Scottish tradition is clear in the present case. In effect, the Scottish constitutional tradition is not that the crown has plenipotentiary imperial prerogative ‘Henry VIII’ powers, unless and until these are expressly limited by parliament.


“Rather the Scottish constitutional tradition is that the crown, the government, only has such powers as are expressly granted to it by the people gathered together in a representative assembly.

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/nov/21/scottish-claim-of-right-brexit-case-against-uk-government-artical-50-supreme-court


I had to look up "plenipotentiary" :- having full power to take independent action.

Shakethedisease

kabayiri wrote: »

Single market access I expect.

I suppose that as the citizens of Southern Europe get more and more depressed, they might drink more and more whisky.

That whisky makes up about a quarter of the UK's full food and drink exports alone. I wouldn't be too dismissive.

Shakethedisease

Thrugelmir wrote: »

What sort of Brexit does NS actually want? Or does it actually matter. As fault will be found in any event. As constantly looking for an angle to plug independence. Leave it too late and the window might close firmly again.

There will be no long drawn up run up next time round I wouldn't imagine. Since a referendum bill is being drawn up in readiness to put before Holyrood. The Greens have already given unconditional support so it will pass.

The window doesn't need to be open for long.

TrickyTree83

Shakethedisease wrote: »

That whisky makes up about a quarter of the UK's full food and drink exports alone. I wouldn't be too dismissive.

UK wide, really?

Do you have the data to back that up?

That Scottish whiskey is ~25% of all UK food and drink exports, worldwide.

Edit: No matter I checked - it's 21.8% from data in 2014.

kabayiri

Shakethedisease wrote: »

That whisky makes up about a quarter of the UK's full food and drink exports alone. I wouldn't be too dismissive.

See it as more opportunistic.

Changes in fortune in Euroland will present opportunities.

Thrugelmir

Shakethedisease wrote: »

Membership of the Single Market is a red line.

Then NS has to expand a lot more on her plans post Brexit.

Shakethedisease

TrickyTree83 wrote: »

UK wide, really?

Do you have the data to back that up?

That Scottish whiskey is ~25% of all UK food and drink exports, worldwide.

Here's where your pal Whytepaper takes his info from.

• Scotch Whisky accounts for around a quarter of UK food and drink exports.
• Scotch Whisky is sold in around 200 markets worldwide.
• Scotch Whisky sells three times its nearest rival whisky.
• Drinkers in the UK often choose to enjoy it with just a little water, but in Spain they mix it with cola. In Japan Scotch is enjoyed with lots of water and ice, and in China with cold green tea.
• More Scotch is sold in one month in France than Cognac in a year.

http://www.scotch-whisky.org.uk/what-we-do/facts-figures/

Or from Liz Truss if you prefer.
Department for Environment, Food & Rural Affairs and The Rt Hon Elizabeth Truss MP First published: 9 May 2016Part of: EU referendum and Food and farming industry

Speaking ahead of her visit, she said:

"We should all raise a toast to our biggest export success. Europe has a taste for Scotch and the industry will do better if we remain in the EU because whisky producers have hassle free, easy access to the Single Market of 500 million people."

Also within the article

Scotch supports around 40,000 jobs across the UK, adds around £5 billion in value to the economy and is vital to the UK balance of trade. EU membership has many advantages for Scotch. The single market, including its regulation of food and drink, and its single trade policy are central to the success of Scotch. It lets us trade across the EU simply and easily and helps give us fairer access to other overseas markets.

The iconic Scottish spirit, worth £125 per second to the UK economy, accounts for almost a quarter of all British food and drink exports, with 90% of all whisky produced in the UK exported around the world. The booming industry also supports 40,000 jobs across the UK – 10,000 of which are employed directly through over 100 distilleries across Scotland.

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/leaving-the-eu-could-put-scotch-whisky-exports-on-the-rocks

TrickyTree83

Shakethedisease wrote: »

Here's where your pal Whytepaper takes his info from.

http://www.scotch-whisky.org.uk/what-we-do/facts-figures/

Or from Liz Truss if you prefer.
Department for Environment, Food & Rural Affairs and The Rt Hon Elizabeth Truss MP First published: 9 May 2016Part of: EU referendum and Food and farming industry Also within the article https://www.gov.uk/government/news/leaving-the-eu-could-put-scotch-whisky-exports-on-the-rocks

I checked the government data. It's fine, it's 21.8%, a quarter is rather generous, a fifth would be more accurate.