The New Fat Scotland 'Thanks for all the Fish' Thread.

Thrugelmir

elantan wrote: »

1.5 trillion in debt busting money is gonna be hard for the UK to find especially once Scotland goes ...

The Treasury has bought up a lot of the debt via QE. In case you missed the news.

I assume Scotlands pensioners will expect to get paid their penions......... There's no soft IScotland. Hardball only.

Shakethedisease

TrickyTree83 wrote: »

So much cloud cuckoo land on this thread right now, it's impossible to counter.

Someone else step up and sort it out.

Delusion about what ? Droning on and on about how the EU won't want Scotland doesn't make it so.

Everyone that posts stuff like that is very hot on the 'won't want'.. but never actually say why and it's not like any of you have insider information. Why don't you enlighten us all with why the EU don't want Scotland to be a part of it after 40 years of, well being a part of it. What's in it for the EU to snub Scotland after they've just voted 62% to remain within it ?

We've already established that just because Theresa May might not want a Scottish referendum isn't any reason for the Scottish Govt not to hold one like they said they would ( May 16 election manifesto ) anyway.

Shakethedisease

Thrugelmir wrote: »

The Treasury has bought up a lot of the debt via QE. In case you missed the news.

I assume Scotlands pensioners will expect to get paid their penions......... There's no soft IScotland. Hardball only.

In that case every ex-pat that lives in Spain, France or elsewhere collecting their pension should be whistling for theirs too. What you've described is never going to happen to Scots who've paid into the UK pot for the last 4 or 5 decades.

Scots pensioners even if Scotland becomes a 'foreign' country.. will get paid their pensions just like those who choose to live in Spain or France do. Otherwise rUK can take today's value of them for every Scots pensioner off the debt they'll be trying to make sure the Scots still pay after leaving the UK. What you're suggesting isn't hardball, it's depriving only Scots pensioners of the rights others from the UK who've paid into the UK pot currently enjoy if they choose to leave the UK and live elsewhere.

TrickyTree83

Shakethedisease wrote: »

Delusion about what ? Droning on and on about how the EU won't want Scotland doesn't make it so.

Everyone that posts stuff like that is very hot on the 'won't want'.. but never actually say why and it's not like any of you have insider information. Why don't you enlighten us all with why the EU don't want Scotland to be a part of it after 40 years of, well being a part of it. What's in it for the EU to snub Scotland after they've just voted 62% to remain within it ?

We've already established that just because Theresa May might not want a Scottish referendum isn't any reason for the Scottish Govt not to hold one like they said they would ( May 16 election manifesto ) anyway.

I haven't the time right now to get into all the little details.

But I will say that whether or not the EU will take Scotland doesn't seem relevant if the idea of independence itself is harmful to Scotland.

Holding a referendum on it seems pointless when the positive argument is so clearly flawed that it doesn't take experts to shoot it down.

Campaigning for it seems like a waste of time when the SNP and other pro independence groups can't explain how they will fund your current spending under the SNP, which needs to be brought under control even now, in the UK and in the EU, with Barnett.

skintmacflint

Shakethedisease wrote: »

In that case every ex-pat that lives in Spain, France or elsewhere collecting their pension should be whistling for theirs too. What you've described is never going to happen to Scots who've paid into the UK pot for the last 4 or 5 decades.

Scots pensioners even if Scotland becomes a 'foreign' country.. will get paid their pensions just like those who choose to live in Spain or France do. Otherwise rUK can take today's value of them for every Scots pensioner off the debt they'll be trying to make sure the Scots still pay after leaving the UK. What you're suggesting isn't hardball, it's depriving only Scots pensioners of the rights others from the UK who've paid into the UK pot currently enjoy if they choose to leave the UK and live elsewhere.

Small problem there is no 'pot' . Or perhaps I should say no accumulated fund. That 'pot' as you call it is derived from real time contributions. During the Indy Ref it was clearly established that Scotland would be paying from its new real time 'pot' for its own pensioners. Would also remind you Swinney had already expressed worries on Scotland being able to afford to pay pensions considering the high percentage of us oldies up here. And that was before the oil price crash.

Sometimes facts are a b****r for plausible misrepresentation.

ruggedtoast

Proud Scots do not have to explain themselves to Tory Brexit junkies.

The main reason for not going last time was to keep the pound.

But that's turning to junk status now anyway thanks to Brexitards.

Thanks Brexitards.

skintmacflint

Shakethedisease wrote: »

Delusion about what ? Droning on and on about how the EU won't want Scotland doesn't make it so.

Everyone that posts stuff like that is very hot on the 'won't want'.. but never actually say why and it's not like any of you have insider information. Why don't you enlighten us all with why the EU don't want Scotland to be a part of it after 40 years of, well being a part of it. What's in it for the EU to snub Scotland after they've just voted 62% to remain within it ?

We've already established that just because Theresa May might not want a Scottish referendum isn't any reason for the Scottish Govt not to hold one like they said they would ( May 16 election manifesto ) anyway.

As far as I understood it, no one has ever said the EU wouldn't want or accept Scotland eventually. . More like just not a timing which suits or fits Sturgeon's demands, nor under Sturgeon's terms , or the and 'status quo' terms you have suggested.

Scotlands future in the EU IMO just isn't their top priority just now IMO.

But I have to add, if I was Merkel and was looking at Scotland, I'd be asking myself how wise it would be to offend one of EU's largest trading partners, and endanger very sensitive Brexit negotiations to pander to Nicola Sturgeon who has dug herself into a hole with her bravado. And only represents 1.6 out of 4 million voters.

Not as if the Scottish people are being badly treated or brutalised. And the EU ref was a UK decision not a Scottish one. At the same time I'd be asking myself how much trouble this new member would be with this government in charge. Considering it gets £1400 extra per capita than the majority of the U.K., which it squanders on freebies to buy votes while neglecting the major public services the funds were allocated for. Then incessantly whines about and deliberately fosters division with the successful union it has been part of for over 300 years.

A government which flaunts and promotes nationalism and flags, which she detests, has accumulated a huge pile of rejected legislation sitting in Brussels due to sheer incompetence , and recently had a new major piece of legislation overturned due to its infringement of human rights. With the Supremem Court judge feeling compelled to issue a statement commenting on totalitarian state interference in family life.

Not forgetting several countries including Germany have upcoming elections, some EU economies are still in trouble, Putin is acting up, the Syrian war crisis, the financial burden of integrating a million migrants and family reunification, subsequent costs of stemming the migrants flow from Africa via Libya, Turkey stomping its foot over visas

To be honest if I was her I wouldn't be in any big rush. But that's just my thoughts. Lol.

skintmacflint

ruggedtoast wrote: »

Proud Scots do not have to explain themselves to Tory Brexit junkies.

The main reason for not going last time was to keep the pound.

But that's turning to junk status now anyway thanks to Brexitards.

Thanks Brexitards.

Does MSE have a wooden spoon award? Just asking.

elantan

Thrugelmir wrote: »

The Treasury has bought up a lot of the debt via QE. In case you missed the news.

I assume Scotlands pensioners will expect to get paid their penions......... There's no soft IScotland. Hardball only.

Pensioners contracts are with the UK ... if people in Scotland don't get them then people in England Wales Ireland Canada and Spain won't be either

Debt is debt and needs to be paid ... it won't be Scotland debt it will be the UK''s we can't legally take it ... but we can if we choose to help you out a wee bit with it

.string.

Shakethedisease wrote: »

Sturgeon doesn't have to ask permission for an advisory referendum. I thought you had read and taken in the article I posted for you. Obviously not.

I liked your post about EU negotiations, but your conclusions don't stack up so well. It's going to be either or.

8:55 AM - 13 Oct 2016

Your first sentence - don't be supercilious, the times you have ignored points and questions made by others is legendary.

Of course I understood your previous post about an advisory referendum, although the way this referendum thing is being touted is not in advisory intent.

We will see how if May responds, she may wait until the SNP is fully committed by an SNP conference decision. But I still think it is likely that she will reply as I wrote by reminding Sturgeon that she must follow the law.

Does the SNP consider itself above the law?

Do its policies trump law?

It raises the prospect that if the SNP want to have a legal referendum they may have to do it twice , one advisory and one legal.

.... at least twice; maybe the rUK as well.