The New Fat Scotland 'Thanks for all the Fish' Thread.

Shakethedisease

Rinoa wrote: »

Theresa May will not abandon Brexit if Scotland threaten to leave the Union. Sturgeon knows that.

It's just another wheeze to set up further confrontation with Westminster. All part of the continuing grudge and grievance strategy.

I sincerely hope it works.

It probably will. That leap from 45% wishing a second referendum to 55% in the event of a hard Brexit is quite telling in itself for a newspaper poll.

It's the nature of or what kind of Brexit itself is which will be the deciding issue. Single Market or not. As I've said, the SNP are hoping for a soft brexit. They can continue campaigning for independence regardless but a soft Brexit means they can do so without all the hinderance and uncertainty of the UK leaving the single market and any potential damage that will do for trade ( either between iScotland/rUK or UK/EU ).

.string.

Shakethedisease wrote: »

Robertson was pretty good on Daily Politics I thought. Just goes to show what different perspectives get you.

As for May refusing one, that's possibly the point. There is now immediate pressure on her to either come right out and say she'll block one, or else admit she can't. Both/either would make for very interesting reactions in Scotland and rUK.

No one's going to tell you the date of any proposed referendum. It's called 'keeping options open and as wide as possible'.

Different perspectives don't alter the fact that he couldn't answer those two questions. The perspectives part is about whether one likes his non-reply or not.

I thought he made a prat of himself.

I doubt Theresa will refuse the referendum because there isn't one, she will probably, I would guess, remind Nicola that as per UK law Sturgeon must request permission, and take the opportunity to make a few derogatory remarks directed directly at SNP Policy.

So neither of your eagerly awaited reactions.

Shakethedisease

.string. wrote: »

Different perspectives don't alter the fact that he couldn't answer those two questions. The perspectives part is about whether one likes his non-reply or not.

I thought he made a prat of himself.

I doubt Theresa will refuse the referendum because there isn't one, she will probably, I would guess, remind Nicola that as per UK law Sturgeon must request permission, and take the opportunity to make a few derogatory remarks directed directly at SNP Policy.

So neither of your eagerly awaited reactions.

Sturgeon doesn't have to ask permission for an advisory referendum. I thought you had read and taken in the article I posted for you. Obviously not.

I liked your post about EU negotiations, but your conclusions don't stack up so well. It's going to be either or.

Donald Tusk ‏@eucopresident 21m21 minutes ago Brussels, Belgium The essence of Brexit as defined in the UK referendum campaign means radically loosening relations with the EU, a de facto "hard Brexit"

Donald Tusk Verified account ‏@eucopresident The only real alternative to a "hard Brexit" is "no Brexit". Even if today hardly anyone believes in such a possibility.

8:55 AM - 13 Oct 2016

kabayiri

I see the logic now.

Westminster sabotages the detailed Brexit negotiations by accepting an advisory Scottish independence referendum and then honouring both the result and placing a high priority on it, just to satisfy 8.5% of UK voters, a significant number of which couldn't even be bothered to vote in the EU referendum.

It really doesn't seem to have much showroom appeal for PM May does it?

The success of the Brexit deal will be the only thing she gets measured against as PM.

TrickyTree83

Shakethedisease wrote: »

No one is stopping England and Wales from leaving the EU. What's your point ?

The only people who separate the vote into regions of the UK are those who cannot accept the result.

Leave voters in Scotland will recognise that it was a UK wide vote.

The same as Leave voters all across the UK. Some Remain voters will also recognise this fact.

If every region of the UK had voted to Remain, but Scotland had voted to Leave - what would be your response?

It's very sad of me to admit, but I have perused the legislation of the EU referendum act recently and found that the UK wide vote is as legal in Scotland as it is in England and Wales, provisions were made, and devolution taken into account. Legally Scotland has to leave as it is a constituent of the UK and this was provisioned for in the EU referendum act.

There is no mechanism that says constituents of the UK can do as they please, we all voted together.

I invite you to read the legislation.

ruggedtoast

Sturgeon is ascendant, and resplendent. She has begun the break up of the United Kingdom.

Ironically it is all thanks to the 'Conservative' government.

Thrugelmir

kabayiri wrote: »

The success of the Brexit deal will be the only thing she gets measured against as PM.

Yep. A general election shortly after the satisfactory conclusion of the Brexit negotiations. A sure way of quelling the rabble.

antrobus

TrickyTree83 wrote: »

£8bn a small price to pay? Reality says not... .

Arithmetic says that it's about £1,500 a person. And in any case it would be a bigger hit to tax revenues than the "up to £3.7bn" that Sturgeon claims Brexit would cost.


More significantly GERS 2015-16 shows Scotland running a fiscal deficit of 9.5%. That's worse than Greece. An independent Scotland trying to get back into the EU and meeting their 3% target is going to have to impose the mother of all austerity programmes.



https://www.holyrood.com/articles/news/scotland%E2%80%99s-fiscal-deficit-over-twice-uk%E2%80%99s-percentage-gdp

Shakethedisease

kabayiri wrote: »

I see the logic now.

Westminster sabotages the detailed Brexit negotiations by accepting an advisory Scottish independence referendum and then honouring both the result and placing a high priority on it, just to satisfy 8.5% of UK voters, a significant number of which couldn't even be bothered to vote in the EU referendum.

It really doesn't seem to have much showroom appeal for PM May does it?

The success of the Brexit deal will be the only thing she gets measured against as PM.

... of England and Wales.

Shakethedisease

TrickyTree83 wrote: »

The only people who separate the vote into regions of the UK are those who cannot accept the result.

Leave voters in Scotland will recognise that it was a UK wide vote.

The same as Leave voters all across the UK. Some Remain voters will also recognise this fact.

If every region of the UK had voted to Remain, but Scotland had voted to Leave - what would be your response?

It's very sad of me to admit, but I have perused the legislation of the EU referendum act recently and found that the UK wide vote is as legal in Scotland as it is in England and Wales, provisions were made, and devolution taken into account. Legally Scotland has to leave as it is a constituent of the UK and this was provisioned for in the EU referendum act.

There is no mechanism that says constituents of the UK can do as they please, we all voted together.

I invite you to read the legislation.

It was advisory. I'd invite you to recognise that fact too.