The New Fat Scotland 'Thanks for all the Fish' Thread.

Shakethedisease

mollycat wrote: »

Oh dear, only 3/10 for this effort at spin

Exactly the opposite is happening; pre election Independence felt like a sinister figure hiding round the corner at the end of the street, now it feels like a distant presence travelling at speed in another direction.

As far away as it's been in a long time

I guess some like to bury their heads in the sand. The Tories, and this particular brand of Tory party with Boris at the helm has been the best thing to happen to independence for since 2016. The election was fantastic, everyone so motivated to get out there and vote for Scotland to have a choice ( goodbye Swinson).

I didn't realise you found independence so scary personally. But I guess there are lots of us in Scotland can say the same about recent Westminster shenanigans. Devolution is no more and there's no way Scots are going back to the 1980's with the Tories in charge. That'll bring even the older Labour voters out for independence.

mollycat

Shakethedisease wrote: »

I guess some like to bury their heads in the sand. The Tories, and this particular brand of Tory party with Boris at the helm has been the best thing to happen to independence for since 2016. The election was fantastic, everyone so motivated to get out there and vote for Scotland to have a choice ( goodbye Swinson).

I didn't realise you found independence so scary personally. But I guess there are lots of us in Scotland can say the same about recent Westminster shenanigans. Devolution is no more and there's no way Scots are going back to the 1980's with the Tories in charge. That'll bring even the older Labour voters out for independence.

No intention to be rude on my part, but IMHO the above is just meaningless, dogmatic drivel.

I know senior SNP players duties are to post the type of thing you post, in an attempt to influence others towards independence.

If it was me trying to persuade my fellow citizens to flush their economic futures down the toilet I don't think i could look at myself in the mirror each morning.....takes all sorts I suppose.

There are lots of just causes in the world for the motivated, and caring to be fighting for; to regard the plight of Scotland in the UK as one of them is insulting and laughable.

Anyway; off for a drink in Dundee city centre where I can almost guarantee nobody will be going on about so called "indyref2"

Shakethedisease

mollycat wrote: »

No intention to be rude on my part, but IMHO the above is just meaningless, dogmatic drivel.

I know senior SNP players duties are to post the type of thing you post, in an attempt to influence others towards independence.

If it was me trying to persuade my fellow citizens to flush their economic futures down the toilet I don't think i could look at myself in the mirror each morning.....takes all sorts I suppose.

There are lots of just causes in the world for the motivated, and caring to be fighting for; to regard the plight of Scotland in the UK as one of them is insulting and laughable.

Anyway; off for a drink in Dundee city centre where I can almost guarantee nobody will be going on about so called "indyref2"

If I was influencing anyone, I sincerely doubt it would be a thread like this buried on MSE. I love the 'plight' thing though. Brexit is a risk to Scottish economic AND political futures. Do enjoy your drink in Scotland's YES city.


I'm not opening up another reply box. Holyrood has just voted not to consent to the Withdrawal Bill.

@BBCPhilipSim
MSPs have backed ScotGov's motion that Holyrood "does not consent" to the Withdrawal Agreement Bill by 92 votes to 29. SNP, Labour, Greens and Lib Dems backed the motion, Tories voted against.

Will be totally ignored of course which kind of makes the SNP/Yes's point for them.

Arklight

Doughty Scots have voted overwhelmingly for Sturgeon. They raise two fingers to the Tories and set their course to Europe and Indy!

Herzlos

mollycat wrote: »

Decades of extreme austerity.

Reduced levels of public services.

Higher taxes.

We've got those already, but without much control over it. Holyrood seems to spend a lot of time, money and effort trying to mitigate the worst of Tory austerity.


Given it's already bad, trying to do it ourselves isn't going to make it much worse, is it?

Shakethedisease

..And I mean come on. If the Scottish NHS is in crisis hitting 85% of A+E patients seen within 4 hours. I don't know what you'd call this for the English one. Jeezo. :eek:

NHS crisis: A&E waiting times hit worst level on record

2,000 accident and emergency patients waited more than 12 hours for a bed in December

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/health/nhs-waiting-time-patient-delay-emergency-department-a9276366.html


Give up with the SNP Scottish NHS in crisis stuff. No one believes it. Certainly not when we see these kinds of figures for the English one. On the contrary, most of us as very grateful that we don't have to put up with anywhere near this sort of NHS mismanagement in Scotland. Thank you Holyrood is all I can say.

molerat

And another failure
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-51052607
All OK though as the central belt will get it.

Shakethedisease

molerat wrote: »

And another failure
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-51052607
All OK though as the central belt will get it.

Broadband is a reserved issue mole. You should know that. Try not to mislead fellow posters. The Scottish Govt are doing what they can off their own back.

Internet and wireless technology, including broadband, has remained under the control of Westminster.

However, the Scottish Government does have power over how UK funding for broadband is used, and may provide additional financial support

They're paying money out and setting themselves the targets... because Westminster can't be a***d. They dont need to.

Just another example of how Holyrood is mitigating against poor management from Westminster even though it's not actually their responsibility to do so. It's the usual old chestnut ( like NHS targets ) for saddos who think the Scottish electorate can't read as to whose in charge of what. Broadband = reserved. End of story.

mollycat

Herzlos wrote: »

We've got those already, but without much control over it. Holyrood seems to spend a lot of time, money and effort trying to mitigate the worst of Tory austerity.


Given it's already bad, trying to do it ourselves isn't going to make it much worse, is it?

Either you don't have a clue or you are deliberately disrespecting the Scottish people by peddling a false narrative.

Decades of extreme austerity, reduced services and higher taxes, (all much in excess of the status quo), will be the options any future independent government will have to "control" an economy that no longer benefits from the wider rUK surplus and has a deficit of circa £8b.

Recent posts about which NHS on which side of the border is doing best, what is a devolved/reserved power, etc, etc are all very good at filling up space, diverting the debate off course, and stoking feelings of them and us, but have absolutely no relevance to the crux of the debate.....how would a small, virtually bankrupt country, out of both the UK and the EU, with no relevance or influence in the wider economic world, generate enough wealth to meet the needs of it's people?

Scotland already has a government, people can already call themselves Scottish instead of British if they choose.....so what is the point of Independence other than to put 6 million people on the road to isolation and hardship.

BTW @Herzlos.....thanks for the subtle misquote a few pages ago. (I know, I know....discredit the opposite view by twisting it...classic tactic).

For clarity I didn't say Independence supporters "hated" the english; I said strong anti-english feeling was a big part of the Independence movement.

Now, if you come back and say that's not true, I'll know you're taking the mickey!

Herzlos

I honestly cant say I know any ondy supporters (and I know a few vocal oned) who are anti English, beyond Westminster.

You keep talking about how badly Scotland will do outside the UK and EU, whilst ignoring how badly Sctoland will do inside the UK and outside the EU. Brexit is going to bring huge pain to Scotland with less control over it. Westminster under the Tories want to actively reduce Scottish influence.

You're trying to compare against a non existent status quo.

Given we're going to be screwed either way, I'd rather take the gamble to go it ourselves then we can at least try and fix it ourselves- by rejoining the EU.