The New Fat Scotland 'Thanks for all the Fish' Thread.

loadsacash

The thing is Shakey maybe nearly 50% of Scots want Independance - but to be fair it was 51% the week before the referendum.

You need to be careful of what you wish for - if Indy wins, do you honestly think the Unionists will just lie down and let it happen. Of course there will be another referendum! If Indy looses, Nicola Sturgeon will follow Alex Salmond and have to go - and she knows it.

Shakethedisease

Arklight wrote: »

100% of everyone in England could want the UK to break up but it’ll still require Scotland to actually vote to go. Which will never happen.

Don’t do it to yourself anymore Shakey, just stop. Eject ‘Braveheart the Director's Cut’ from your Blu-ray player. Take down the life size posters of Alex Salmond from the living room, stop The Proclaimers playing on repeat in the car, and cancel to the direct debit to that plonker in Bath. He’s spending it all on Bucky, Dominos, and rent to his mum,

Just accept that you live in a country. A country called the United Kingdom. You and all the rest of you are legally and very bindingly British. You were born British and you will die British. Subjects of Her / Hjs Britannic Maj.

Forever.

Wow, what a creative post. I take my hat off to you for managing to shoehorn in nearly every Scottish stereotype imaginable. It made me smile briefly.. but it's not really a post I'm going to waste much time on other than to applaud your wild imagination. Bravo ! :T

Shakethedisease

loadsacash wrote: »

The thing is Shakey maybe nearly 50% of Scots want Independance - but to be fair it was 51% the week before the referendum.

You need to be careful of what you wish for - if Indy wins, do you honestly think the Unionists will just lie down and let it happen. Of course there will be another referendum! If Indy looses, Nicola Sturgeon will follow Alex Salmond and have to go - and she knows it.

You're thinking too short term. When I say the UK is on it's last legs I'm talking about gradual shifts ( which have been accelerating over the last few years ). From devolution, to the SNP running a minority govt Holyrood in in 2007, majority in 2011. The ref, SNP MPs going from 6 to 56/35.. Labour now placed third place in the polls and Tory govt determined to ignore Scotland altogether etc etc etc

It's all coming together gradually. 10 years ago most people in the rUK would've been hard pressed to name the leader of the SNP, or any MP's. Now you all know the names of even opposition Holyrood MSP's and leaders. And general elections now seem to hinge on who can be stuffed into the SNP leaders top pocket on massive rUK billboards. The first referendum accelerated things greatly. Brexit is giving another rocket boost to straining Scotland / rUK political relations. And when I say that I don't actually mean with the SNP... I mean with ordinary people and voters.

Taking Scotland out of the EU is a risky move when Scotland's ordinary people do not want to leave. Ignoring Scotland even within negotiations, as well as going to court in order to overide and take over powers currently residing at Holyrood ?.. is riskier still.

Somethings got to give soon. And from the gradual direction of travel, well, it's pretty obvious which direction things are all headed. The UK as it stands is on it's last legs. Guardian columnists are getting quite worried..

Like Banksy’s artwork, the United Kingdom is shredding itself in public

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/oct/13/banksy-shredded-art-united-kingdom-britain-brexit-union

Now Brexit really is threatening to tear the UK apart

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/oct/10/brexit-threat-theresa-may-uk-scotland-northern-ireland-union

loadsacash

Taking Scotland out of the EU is a risky move when Scotland's ordinary people do not want to leave.

I voted remain - as did lots of people - but the majority voted to leave so Leave wins - that is democracy.

How come Nicola Sturgeon is willing to fight for what I feel in the European Referendum ignores my vote no in the Independence Referendum?

cogito

Shakethedisease wrote: »

You're thinking too short term. When I say the UK is on it's last legs I'm talking about gradual shifts ( which have been accelerating over the last few years ). From devolution, to the SNP running a minority govt Holyrood in in 2007, majority in 2011. The ref, SNP MPs going from 6 to 56/35.. Labour now placed third place in the polls and Tory govt determined to ignore Scotland altogether etc etc etc

It's all coming together gradually. 10 years ago most people in the rUK would've been hard pressed to name the leader of the SNP, or any MP's. Now you all know the names of even opposition Holyrood MSP's and leaders. And general elections now seem to hinge on who can be stuffed into the SNP leaders top pocket on massive rUK billboards. The first referendum accelerated things greatly. Brexit is giving another rocket boost to straining Scotland / rUK political relations. And when I say that I don't actually mean with the SNP... I mean with ordinary people and voters.

Taking Scotland out of the EU is a risky move when Scotland's ordinary people do not want to leave. Ignoring Scotland even within negotiations, as well as going to court in order to overide and take over powers currently residing at Holyrood ?.. is riskier still.

Somethings got to give soon. And from the gradual direction of travel, well, it's pretty obvious which direction things are all headed. The UK as it stands is on it's last legs. Guardian columnists are getting quite worried.. https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/oct/13/banksy-shredded-art-united-kingdom-britain-brexit-unionhttps://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/oct/10/brexit-threat-theresa-may-uk-scotland-northern-ireland-union

Know something? The majority of people in England couldn't care less about Scotland. If they want to leave the Union, that's fine. If they want to stay, that's fine too.

And why don't the English care? It's simply because of the endless whinging from the SNP about Westminster (which we all know is a code word for the English). You're so badly done to that we only send you a miserly £9bn a year because without it, Scotland would be an even bigger basket case than it is today and part of the reason why it's a basket case is the hopeless mismanagement of devolved services like education and policing caused by the SNP. But, hey, let's blame that on the English too.

Arklight

cogito wrote: »

Know something? The majority of people in England couldn't care less about Scotland. If they want to leave the Union, that's fine. If they want to stay, that's fine too.

And why don't the English care? It's simply because of the endless whinging from the SNP about Westminster (which we all know is a code word for the English). You're so badly done to that we only send you a miserly £9bn a year because without it, Scotland would be an even bigger basket case than it is today and part of the reason why it's a basket case is the hopeless mismanagement of devolved services like education and policing caused by the SNP. But, hey, let's blame that on the English too.

Or to put it another way, the vast majority of selfish, self obsessed, Tory voting right wingers, couldn't care less about Scotland, or refugees, or the poor, or kids in education, or the NHS, or really anyone else.

For those of us who have a national identity that isn't entirely predicated on serving themselves and promoting beggar thy neighbour Darwinism, Scotland is another part of the place we live.

I am not exactly delighted that the reason so many Scots want to leave is because so many English people are wedded to the ideology of the desert of hopeless, heartless, class based corporatism.

It is encouraging however that this view is a minority view among younger people (none of who's views are represented on this forum) and joking aside about the Proclaimers, I would ask our Scottish friends to wait a wee bit longer before deciding to go it alone. English politics is likely to be very different in 10 years time, and hopefully once the blue rosettes and their cortege of permanently outraged red faces are booted, the entire country will be a much nicer place to be for everyone (even them actually, although they're incapable of seeing it).

cogito

Perfect. Your words 'permanently outraged red faces' sum up your rant wonderfully.

If you want to live in a socialist paradise, try Venezuela. Your mate Jeremy thinks it's great. Not that we've heard much from him on the subject of late.

loadsacash

cogito wrote: »

Perfect. Your words 'permanently outraged red faces' sum up your rant wonderfully.

If you want to live in a socialist paradise, try Venezuela. Your mate Jeremy thinks it's great. Not that we've heard much from him on the subject of late.

What do you mean "Your mate Jeremy" the Yes supporters call him a "Red Tory"

Seriously though Nicola Sturgeon dishes out "Its all Westminsters fault" and "Its all down the Tory Austerity" while in reality The Scottish Government doesn't spend all the money that it gets from the rest of the UK and has a rather nice surplus!

Nasqueron

Shakethedisease wrote: »

You're thinking too short term. When I say the UK is on it's last legs I'm talking about gradual shifts ( which have been accelerating over the last few years ). From devolution, to the SNP running a minority govt Holyrood in in 2007, majority in 2011. The ref, SNP MPs going from 6 to 56/35.. Labour now placed third place in the polls and Tory govt determined to ignore Scotland altogether etc etc etc

It's all coming together gradually. 10 years ago most people in the rUK would've been hard pressed to name the leader of the SNP, or any MP's. Now you all know the names of even opposition Holyrood MSP's and leaders. And general elections now seem to hinge on who can be stuffed into the SNP leaders top pocket on massive rUK billboards. The first referendum accelerated things greatly. Brexit is giving another rocket boost to straining Scotland / rUK political relations. And when I say that I don't actually mean with the SNP... I mean with ordinary people and voters.

Taking Scotland out of the EU is a risky move when Scotland's ordinary people do not want to leave. Ignoring Scotland even within negotiations, as well as going to court in order to overide and take over powers currently residing at Holyrood ?.. is riskier still.

Somethings got to give soon. And from the gradual direction of travel, well, it's pretty obvious which direction things are all headed. The UK as it stands is on it's last legs. Guardian columnists are getting quite worried.. https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/oct/13/banksy-shredded-art-united-kingdom-britain-brexit-unionhttps://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/oct/10/brexit-threat-theresa-may-uk-scotland-northern-ireland-union

And yet with all that and the various lies / tricks Salmond used he still couldn't even get to 50%

-Deliberately chose a biased, leading question for the poll which had to be slapped down by the electoral commission
-Held the vote in 2014 to coincide with the 700th anniversary of Bannockburn (with lots of spending tied in with the Scottish National Trust) as well as the Commonwealth games (where they compete as independent)
-Got votes for 16 year olds as they believed the kids would all vote leave
-Promised to keep the pound (RoUK said no)
-Promised they would remain in Europe via a transition (Europe said no) because applying as a new state would get vetoed by Spain to discourage the Catalan separatists
-Promised they would stay in NATO (NATO said no)

All that and this "once in a generation" vote suddenly becomes a "once every few years" thing until they get the correct decision for the SNP

baldelectrician

Nasqueron wrote: »

And yet with all that and the various lies / tricks Salmond used he still couldn't even get to 50%

-Held the vote in 2014 to coincide with the 700th anniversary of Bannockburn (with lots of spending tied in with the Scottish National Trust) as well as the Commonwealth games (where they compete as independent)
It was a condition of the section 30 order from Westminster that the vote had to be held before the UK general election.


-Got votes for 16 year olds as they believed the kids would all vote leave
This is also Labour, Lid-Dem and Green policy

-Promised to keep the pound (RoUK said no)
Anyone can use the £- with or without consent- the fact that Australia, Canada, USA, Ireland have all used the £ in the past is quite significant
If the Scots did not use the £ sterling it would have effects for Sterling- see video


-Promised they would remain in Europe via a transition (Europe said no) because applying as a new state would get vetoed by Spain to discourage the Catalan separatists
More than one opinion on this, see here

-Promised they would stay in NATO (NATO said no)
Bit short sighted as Prestwick covers the North Atlantic between the UK / Ireland and the bottom of Iceland's waters

All that and this "once in a generation" vote suddenly becomes a "once every few years" thing until they get the correct decision for the SNP
We live in a democracy (look it up) where one parliament cannot bind future parliaments (for example Tony Blair could not rule out a referendum on Indy as the next government may have something in their manifesto.
Why not have a look at one of Ruth Davisdons opinions (she has several and if you don't agree with the one above she has others)
/QUOTE]

The SNP put a referendum in the manifesto and got over 50% of the seats as MP's
The SNP also got a higher share of the Scottish vote than the Conservatives did across the UK (bear in mind the Conservatives are in the UK government with a lower share of the UK vote than the SNP got in Scotland.)