The New Fat Scotland 'Thanks for all the Fish' Thread.

elantan

Ruth did look rather fetching in her new costume with her new honour ...

elantan

https://twitter.com/ToryFibs/status/878952701245218817

Australians seem to find Brexit funny at least ... spose we should look for the humour

kelpie35

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4637658/Nicola-Sturgeon-park-plans-indpeendence-referendum.html

Hooray, at last she has seen the light.

thenel

labour in Scotland advocated voting tory. that is shameful. :mad:

TrickyTree83

Shakethedisease wrote: »

They voted for, and I quote 'Ruth Davidson's Conservative party candidate' <--- insert candidate name. Davidson only has one policy.



The second ref is only on the table as a result of Brexit though. There was nothing much otherwise that Sturgeon could do in light of the way Scots votes went in the EU ref ( 62% can hardly be ignored in favour of 38% in any ballot ). She did offer to take it off the table if there was a way Scotland could stay in the Single Market but was ignored. Sturgeon is quiet now because she and everyone else need a breather and to let Brexit negotiations and Tory/DUP deals take centre stage for a while.

Get this straight though, there are people and political parties such as the SNP that will always want Scottish independence. But the immediacy of any second ref is only the result of Scotland possibly being taken out of the Single Market. Something which Sturgeon and the SNP regard as a potentially catastrophic economic event for the UK as well as Scotland.

Interestingly Davidson is now ( flip flopping ) advocating exactly what the SNP has been saying for the last year re the Single Market. As are half the UK Labour party and a fair number of Tories too.

If the UK stays in the Single Market then there is no rush to a second indy ref. It's the hard Brexit no Single Market, no customs union no deal/better than bad deal approach to negotiations.. which will guarantee one though should it happen.

After the Brexit dust has settled if there's no indy ref as a consequence ( ie UK stays in Single Market ) then it's pretty much demographics in Scotland that will ensure independence at some point.

The 2nd independence referendum idea has been rejected by the electorate.

Young people grow up and change their political views. You might find that because the SNP is a regional party who campaigns on regional issues will lose out to a Labour that is further left than recent history in order to get a government that is left leaning. This seems more likely than your claim that demographics is somehow going to deliver your dream of Alba at some point in the distant future. The young will see that MP's aligned with UK national parties actually get things done for Scotland instead of whinging.

I think you've blown it. I think the SNP have blown it, too divisive, too closed minded, too reticent to address the reality of the issues iScotland would face, too many lies to attempt to persuade the easily misguided, etc... the wrong tactics at the right time. The SNP are now changing tactics but they're now scarred by the recent past.

Shakethedisease

TrickyTree83 wrote: »

The 2nd independence referendum idea has been rejected by the electorate.

Young people grow up and change their political views. You might find that because the SNP is a regional party who campaigns on regional issues will lose out to a Labour that is further left than recent history in order to get a government that is left leaning. This seems more likely than your claim that demographics is somehow going to deliver your dream of Alba at some point in the distant future. The young will see that MP's aligned with UK national parties actually get things done for Scotland instead of whinging.

I think you've blown it. I think the SNP have blown it, too divisive, too closed minded, too reticent to address the reality of the issues iScotland would face, too many lies to attempt to persuade the easily misguided, etc... the wrong tactics at the right time. The SNP are now changing tactics but they're now scarred by the recent past.

No, I don't accept this GE changed anything much. 6, 56, 35 MP's is all the same. In 2011 support for an indy ref was at barely 35% and independence itself at 28%. Another vote is two years away still and as we've seen, nothing can be predicted until campaigns get underway ( see Corbyn in GE ).

What I do think is that the SNP and pro indy factions/support are running on empty at the moment. And it's definitely time to take a breather, and watch the Tory/DUP/Brexit s***storm unfold. As well as the Labour party internal war over Single Market membership.

Davidson has nothing to talk about if the SNP are being quiet about a second indy ref. But talk she and her new Tory MP's are going to have to. Those farmers and fishermen who put such faith in them in Salmond and Robertson's seats.. wanting to leave the EU yet retain full single market access are counting on Davidson/May now to deliver and Davidson knows it well ( hence her flip flop over the Single Market after the GE ). Plus Corbyn for the moment is just as hard Brexit as May is.

There's either a political catastrophe on the way ( EEA option retaining FOM and paying into the EU ).. or an economic one ( out of the Single Market ). Which one do you think it'll be ? Because it's one or the other with an indy ref only dependent on the second one.

mrginge

Still harping on about the same tired rhetoric even after you've been mugged off by the electorate.

Everyone else has moved on, yet shakey's still banging the drum.

Shakethedisease

mrginge wrote: »

Still harping on about the same tired rhetoric even after you've been mugged off by the electorate.

Everyone else has moved on, yet shakey's still banging the drum.

*shrugs* I was responding to a post someone else made. However you're right, I have been getting pretty bored dealing with posters like you on here all the time. There's just nothing to work with..

kabayiri

Labour and Tory both campaigned on a policy of implementing Brexit.

Both increased their vote share.

SNP; LibDem; Greens ... they all wanted some form of secondary vote/reassessment of Brexit.

Look at what happened to them.

It's now down to what sort of deal the EU will offer. There is always a price beyond which the government will refuse to pay. For this reason, the exit without agreement option will remain until the whole thing completes.

mrginge

Shakethedisease wrote: »

*shrugs* I was responding to a post someone else made. However you're right, I have been getting pretty bored dealing with posters like you on here all the time. There's just nothing to work with..

You're not dealing with anyone.
Just like the snp.