If we vote for Brexit what happens

londonTiger

CLAPTON wrote: »

why are these companies manufacturing in the UK : is it because they love us dearly and doing us a favour or good business?

That was the deal we made. You can't export as much cars into the coutry from overseas but you will need to build factories here to gain our market. Which is fair enough, but considering that if Britain leaves the EU. Then it's no longer so rosy. Nissan (UK) ltd wont be able to transfer surplus stock to Nissan Spain, Italy, France etc. Suddenly it's not a great prospect. If Nissan wants to build a flagship factory in Europe - it's going to prefer a strong EU country than isolated Norway, UK [post brexit] or Switzerland.

Uk car market wouldn't be as promising. WHy make cars in a country that is flooded with cars and has a surplus of used cars around which make selling cars difficult when you can target emerging markets like China, Brazil, India.

londonTiger

Robisere wrote: »

There is just one factor which prevents me from completely agreeing with the "Out" vote.

What happens to the jobs that my grandchildren lose, if the UK leaves the EU?

We live in East Lindsey, Lincolnshire, where many jobs are seasonal, connected with the resorts along the coast. There is major investment by large German, Danish and British companies in renewables factories along the Humber, which has transformed the outlook for our young people, partcularly in engineering. Siemens, for example, have favoured engineering connections around Lincoln for over 50 years. This has now developed into heavy investment, even to the point of financing and building a whole new Engineering campus at Lincoln University. The whole area of Lincolnshire and East Yorkshire will benefit from all this investment and expansion, with knock-on effects for smaller companies and suppliers. Already colleges and other educational establishments are seeing greater uptakes in engineering. This is something that will lift our area out of seasonal dependency and stop the flow of young people out of our counties.

There are two problems: because this country has ignored engineering education for so long, there are too few trained, mature engineers coming into the colleges, to pass on their knowledge and expertise to the next generation. Next problem is a 'What If':

What if we leave the EU, and these companies leave the UK? Where does that leave my 17 year old grandson, currently attending a 3 day Engineering course at Grimsby Institute and working 2 days at an engineering plant? Where does it leave my 22 year old grandson, a computer networking engineer, whose small but highly advanced company is investing in technology to work with these companies?

Can anyone with a reliable enough crystal ball, answer that? Of course not. I have to say that there are areas of the EU that I completely disagree with. For instance, the evident corruption of an organisation that consistently refuses to expose its accounts to public scrutiny. The fact that we in the UK voted for a Common Market, not a United States of Europe. The continual drain on our resources by the migrants that we are not allowed to prevent entering our country. The continual wearing away of our sovereignity by unelected Brussels bureaucrats. I could go on and on, but all of that pales into insignificance for me against the possibilty of my grandsons losing the chance to prosper in employment that will keep them in the 21st Century.

Thank Thatcher for that, she thought it would be a good move to completely destroy industry and turn Britian into some sort of tax haven for internatinal investors. Without realising that the Island has 60M people who need jobs.

Sure the unions were a strangehold to industry but every other country had unions. Japan had a union problem, France had a union problem. They didn't deal with it by destroy their entire field of work.

Germany are reaping the benefits of retaining their manufacturing base, they are exporting cars into China. What the heck are we exporting to China?

CLAPTON

londonTiger wrote: »

Where are surrounded by EC countries. The nearest non EC country are Norway, Iceland, Switzerland and north Africa. USA & Canada are miles away and are very expensive ship items from .

Also ask yourself why Iceland, Norway & Switzerland are not in the EU.

As I said before Switzerland is a tax haven and financial hub. Financial services are not VATed and there are no tariffs for it. Ultra rich individuals and businessess will use Swiss financial services regardless of whether they are EU member or not. So why should switzerland bear the cost of EU membership?

Iceland is a small nation with a population of just 323,000. Read again, 323,000. 6 figures! They have access to vast ocean reserves and can fish the north Atlantic easily. Waters which no other country would bother sailing to. Large population in North America and Europe need to be fed - they have an easy market to export to.

Norway - again small population with oil wealth. They have a product that everyone wants.

why does Germany want to lose that trade?
I don't know what you say about VAT is correct but it doesn't seem right to me.

CLAPTON

londonTiger wrote: »

Thank Thatcher for that, she thought it would be a good move to completely destroy industry and turn Britian into some sort of tax haven for internatinal investors. Without realising that the Island has 60M people who need jobs.

Sure the unions were a strangehold to industry but every other country had unions. Japan had a union problem, France had a union problem. They didn't deal with it by destroy their entire field of work.

Germany are reaping the benefits of retaining their manufacturing base, they are exporting cars into China. What the heck are we exporting to China?

British manufacturing in the 70/80s was destroyed by the unions and the rubbish products and oil.

under thatcher we started to build cars that people abroad actually wanted to buy.

we are the 6th largest manufacturer in the world.

londonTiger

CLAPTON wrote: »

British manufacturing in the 70/80s was destroyed by the unions and the rubbish products and oil.

under thatcher we started to build cars that people abroad actually wanted to buy.

we are the 6th largest manufacturer in the world.

"We" as in Indian/Chinese/German/American/Japanese owned companies you mean?

They're built by machines built by the respective owners, where the IP belongs to them. The companies probably operate out of a tax haven like Stabucks does where they pay "licesning fees" to the parent company based offshore so they artificually deflate their profits and reduce corporation tax liability.

There are no major British owned companies, you only have companies like Noble, Lotus, Mclaren etc who make money for a small group of people and doesn't made a huge dent into our GDP.

LOL.. what cars did we make under Tatcher? She destroyed industry and invited the Japanese to come here and set up shop.

CLAPTON

londonTiger wrote: »

"We" as in Indian/Chinese/German/American/Japanese owned companies you mean?

what's you point?
would you prefer those jobs being in other countries
and how does that relate to Brexit?

londonTiger

CLAPTON wrote: »

why does Germany want to lose that trade?
I don't know what you say about VAT is correct but it doesn't seem right to me.

They would rather not have the UK leave. Germany are saying to the UK, "don't leave". At the moment Cameron for PR purposes is threatening to leave just to look good to the UK public. But the Germans are calling his bluff and saying "look don't leave, but free movement is non-negiotable, if I had to pick one I'd rather you leave than compromise our principles".

Post Brexit, it's not a question of whether Germany wants to lose trade or not. Market forces will dictate this and make trade too expensive

VAT
Currently VAT is deducted at source so a German VAT registered business will supply goods to a UK VAT registered business with 0% VAT.

To all businesses based outside of the EC companies must charge their respective VAT rates.

So on Brexit a UK business will incur German VAT that they cannot reclaim. Plus there are duties on import that we as brits pay on all non EU imports which will make buying stuff from Germany suddenly much more expensive. Similarly selling stuff to Germany will be much more expensive.

CLAPTON

londonTiger wrote: »

They would rather not have the UK leave. Germany are saying to the UK, "don't leave". At the moment Cameron for PR purposes is threatening to leave just to look good to the UK public. But the Germans are calling his bluff and saying "look don't leave, but free movement is non-negiotable, if I had to pick one I'd rather you leave than compromise our principles".

Post Brexit, it's not a question of whether Germany wants to lose trade or not. Market forces will dictate this and make trade too expensive

VAT
Currently VAT is deducted at source so a German VAT registered business will supply goods to a UK VAT registered business with 0% VAT.

To all businesses based outside of the EC companies must charge their respective VAT rates.

So on Brexit a UK business will incur German VAT that they cannot reclaim. Plus there are duties on import that we as brits pay on all non EU imports which will make buying stuff from Germany suddenly much more expensive. Similarly selling stuff to Germany will be much more expensive.

so German industry will be badly damaged by the action of their own government : definitely a vote winner in germany

how do countries like China , India, Aus, etc manage to trade with the EU?

londonTiger

CLAPTON wrote: »

so German industry will be badly damaged by the action of their own government : definitely a vote winner in germany

how do countries like China , India, Aus, etc manage to trade with the EU?

Germany will be mildly effected. We brits do love our German cars and will probably made BMWs more expensive. But Germany still has 500million more people to sell cars to in the EU. Germany wont be as effected as we would. Germany remains in the EU. We are threatening to leave.

I dont think you get it. Why do you keep dragging Germany into this? Germany might even benefit, we are one less advanced economy in the EU which means less competition. which means it leaves Germany and France to dominate Europe. Heck on post exit HSBC might decide to move to France or Germany (and so too other international banks).

India & China trade with the EU based on EU needs. Anything domestic that the EU wants to protect it will impose high duties on imports Cming in from India and China (and ROW for that matter). Dont want Chinese steel? fine slap on 30% duty on all Chinese steel.

We too as UK (post exit) be dictated this way. There's going to be a lot of paperwork and a lot of duties involved. EU [read Germany and France] wants to keep their steel industry healthy? Fine, impose 30% duty on British steel.

CLAPTON

londonTiger wrote: »

Germany will be mildly effected. We brits do love our German cars and will probably made BMWs more expensive. But Germany still has 500million more people to sell cars to in the EU. Germany wont be as effected as we would. Germany remains in the EU. We are threatening to leave.

I dont think you get it. Why do you keep dragging Germany into this? Germany might even benefit, we are one less advanced economy in the EU which means less competition. which means it leaves Germany and France to dominate Europe. Heck on post exit HSBC might decide to move to France or Germany (and so too other international banks).

India & China trade with the EU based on EU needs. Anything domestic that the EU wants to protect it will impose high duties on imports Cming in from India and China (and ROW for that matter). Dont want Chinese steel? fine slap on 30% duty on all Chinese steel.

We too as UK (post exit) be dictated this way. There's going to be a lot of paperwork and a lot of duties involved. EU [read Germany and France] wants to keep their steel industry healthy? Fine, impose 30% duty on British steel.

so india and china don't like a 30% duty on their steel so they slap 100% duty on german cars and other EU manufactured products

trade is mutually beneficial (that means to both parties): no reason to expect a world wide trade war because of Ukexit