Stores that DON'T accept contactless payments - name and shame!

badger09

colsten wrote: »

These numbers are a little dated now and I can't on the quick find anything later, but they are still very relevant when seen in the context of other fraud in the same period:

Cheque fraud: £10.5m (205 times the contactless fraud)
Counterfeit cards fraud: £24.2m (475 times the contactless fraud)
Distraction thefts in shops and at ATMs: £29.2 million (572 times the contactless fraud)

I would recommend that those concerned about contactless fraud immediately stop using their chip & PIN cards as well as cheques, as they both are obviously incredibly unsafe.

And the really bad news for the worriers is that online and telephone banking is also incredibly unsafe. Tin hat time, folks, methinks!
Online banking fraud: £29.3m (574 times)
Telephone banking fraud: £6.6m (129 times)

I'm not arguing either for, or against contactless cards but at that time, the limit on contactless payments was £20 per transaction.

The limit (if there is one) on the other methods was substantially higher, and without knowing the total volume of those other methods, I'm not sure one can draw conclusions on their relative safety:cool:

badger09

Hazmongrel wrote: »

Does anyone know if you get cashback for getting cashback? The self serve checkouts at my Morrisons let you get cashback, so I'm hoping I can get 5% back from withdrawing cash that way.

I think others have posted that a PIN is required for cashback transactions.

Steve_xx

Hazmongrel wrote: »

Does anyone know if you get cashback for getting cashback? The self serve checkouts at my Morrisons let you get cashback, so I'm hoping I can get 5% back from withdrawing cash that way.

It's an interesting question. I think/hope that it will not be possible to get cash at all on a contactless basis. Bearing in mind anyway that contactless is limited to transactions of £30 or less anyway.

YorkshireBoy

Steve_xx wrote: »

It's an interesting question.

And one which is answered by loads of banks in their T&Cs and/or FAQs. A quick google search for...

"Can I get cashback..."

...autofills with "using contactless" (so it must have been searched 1000s of times!).

https://www.google.co.uk/#q=can+i+get+cashback+using+contactless

masonic

marleyboy wrote: »

I'm thinking more on the lines of it remaining a chip n pin up until you use the contactless method for the first time, requiring a PIN thus rendering the card contactless.

I would be more happier in knowing my card was still only a chip n pin as I have not used any contactless methods.

Your understanding is correct. However, if you put your card into a 'contactless enabled' terminal, there is a high likelihood it will attempt a contactless transaction before reading the chip, thus activating your card for future contactless payments, which would not even be noticeable by you. Perhaps that is why you want to boycott any shops that accept contactless payments - to avoid accidental activation of your card during a chip and pin transaction?

agrinnall

Steve_xx wrote: »

Why would you be pleased about that?

I don't for a minute believe that I've contradicted what I thought I'd said originally.

The card, after it arrives, cannot be used 'contactless' until the PIN is input. So if you go to Iceland and buy some milk with your new card in your hand, not having used it before with its PIN, you will be required to enter the PIN at the point that you pay for the milk. The card will not operate contactless at this point and this first transaction will be deemed not to be a 'contactless' payment. Only after the transaction for the milk has been made will you be able to go on and make a contactless payment.

That is my understanding of it and that is how I presented my explanation earlier.

Well, I read this bit of your quote from Lloyds as referring to the first time a contactless transaction is attempted.

"The first time you use your contactless card for a transaction, you’ll need to enter your PIN."

However, I can see that may just be me reading it in a way that backed up my case, and your subsequent quote from TSB suggests that I was indeed wrong.

Which is slightly concerning if it applies to other issuers (I don't have a Lloyds card and I never use my TSB card at all) as it would mean contactless has been activated without me specifically requesting it. I don't believe card issuers should be doing this, although I've no doubt they have themselves very well covered in their T&Cs.

gunsandbanjos

colsten wrote: »

Cheque fraud: £10.5m (205 times the contactless fraud)
Counterfeit cards fraud: £24.2m (475 times the contactless fraud)
Distraction thefts in shops and at ATMs: £29.2 million (572 times the contactless fraud)

I would recommend that those concerned about contactless fraud immediately stop using their chip & PIN cards as well as cheques, as they both are obviously incredibly unsafe.

And the really bad news for the worriers is that online and telephone banking is also incredibly unsafe. Tin hat time, folks, methinks!
Online banking fraud: £29.3m (574 times)
Telephone banking fraud: £6.6m (129 times)

uh oh, the tinfoil hat brigade are going to have kittens at the online and telephone figures!!
Would be nice to have it split so we knew how much was due to phishing/vishing and people giving all their security information to the pesky fraudsters. Or even just transferring their money straight to the fraudsters account.

I work in banking fraud and I'm quite happy to use contactless, it's so much quicker.

marleyboy

masonic wrote: »

Perhaps that is why you want to boycott any shops that accept contactless payments - to avoid accidental activation of your card during a chip and pin transaction?

No, No, my boycott would be if a store INSISTED on contactless payment. I am happy to use chip n pin, cash is always king but I would not be prepared to return from an ATM with cash were a store to refuse my chip n pin method.

colsten

badger09 wrote: »

I'm not arguing either for, or against contactless cards but at that time, the limit on contactless payments was £20 per transaction.

The limit (if there is one) on the other methods was substantially higher, and without knowing the total volume of those other methods, I'm not sure one can draw conclusions on their relative safety:cool:

Well yes, I do see your point - - which effectively just supports that you can't lose a lot of money with contactless as the value (even with the new £30 limit) is always limited. And, as has been pointed out countless times, you do get your money back if your contactless card has been used by fraudsters.

As an aside, I'd love to know how many smart alecs are trying to trick their card issuers into believing their cards were stolen, in the hope they can 'enrich' themselves. No safer way to a CIFAS first party fraud marker, I reckon.

marleyboy

gunsandbanjos wrote: »

I'm quite happy to use contactless, it's so much quicker.

I'm not, as such it should be the case that if your NOT happy using contactless for whatever reason you can imagine, then you are given a choice where you simply don't activate the contactless method and keep it as a chip n pin.